I couldnтАЩt help but laugh last night thinking about Joe and Mika in high drama form this morning. I used to check in to see them, but I know the first half hour is dedicated to Trump! They sure loved him before 2016!
I find myself supremely surprised to be in the position of defending Pence, but I thought he did really well. I went into the debate expecting to not even consider him and yet I consistently found myself nodding along to his answers. Even on abortion! I am a GenZ woman and I was shocked that he took a moderate position that many can agree on! I have immense respect for anyone that is willing to put the needs and desires of this country above their own personal beliefs. I like Vivek but honestly, American needs a leader who can work with those they disagree with and I think Vivek showed that heтАЩs not that guy.
You and I agree that rolling over your opposition is not productive for this country.
But I think that you are wrong to imply that working across the aisle makes a leader a тАЬsuckerтАЭ. America wonтАЩt survive as a Democracy if we elect someone who sees half of Americans as losers who need to be тАЬre-educatedтАЭ and this applies to BOTH parties.
We all need to remember that Twitter, Substack, and the internet in general, doesnтАЩt represent people at their best. When I walk out my front door, I find that the majority of Americans want to work together.
We absolutely can disagree and still work together. That is the beauty of a free country, we donтАЩt have to hold the same beliefs.
Appreciate the support! IтАЩm hopeful that my generation is starting to draw away from hyper polarization. IтАЩve seen a lot more discussion about the effects of constant social media use on our perception of ourselves and each other.
I used to be pretty far left until I took a break for social media and started paying attention to those I encountered in real life. I found that even when I disagreed with someoneтАЩs politics, we could almost always find common ground on our values and hope for this countries future. America is tough, we will find a way forward together.
Glad to read your comments - I'm a late millennial (so a lot older than you) but have always been pretty far to the left. However, one difference I see generationally is that when I was in school, college, etc. we were REGULARLY taught to debate, read, discuss points of view that were really varied and even throughout college we were often asked to defend a position we didn't agree with as way to stregthen our own argument as you say, but also to keep an open mind. So you didn't see words like "full of hate" "fascist" "hater" "supremacist", etc. being tossed around SO lightly like they are today. Which is a VERY dangerous thing. I can disagree with you politically on any position and not "hate" you or wish you harm, or wish your entire reputation and career destroyed over one statement, based on a accusation backed up by the latest Twitter hot-take. That is a VERY dangerous way forward. So I hope Gen Zs like you can help sway the pendulum back to something more reasonable and truly tolerant - social media is here to stay, and I think a lot of what Gen Z has brought forward is GREAT - but you can't be starting fires/wars/and battles all day. At some point, you need to get real things done and that means being practical and TRULY tolerant.
Millennial here but completely agree. Social media can really warp peopleтАЩs perceptions of real life and I derive a lot of value from having friends on both ends of the aisle. Even when I donтАЩt agree, hearing the other sideтАЩs stance on an issue helps refine mine and IтАЩve even been able to alter other peopleтАЩs thoughts on issues close to me. I have hope too that if we can just get people conversing like humans again, we all stand a chance.
Pence was outstanding during the latter part of the debate. National Review expressed amazement that he seemed to be winning it, so counter-intuitive, but he was very strong even if audience hated him.
I thought I was the only person thinking that. Pence to me has always been as exciting as wet toast. He certainly isn't the shiny new thing but in my mind he held his own. I don't care that he found Jesus and I try to look at the complete ticket. Pence/Haley?
The moderators were quite incompetent. In future debates, get rid of he silly bell to signal the end of time. Just turn off the microphone when time's up, that shouldn't be hard.
I am fine with glib if it can be backed up. But I giggled at your comment (not at you, just the comment) because I find Carlson's earnestness annoying. I like Pompeo's straightforward brand of earnestness.
PenceтАЩs earnestness that people dislike is his earnest desire to win with decency and integrity and compromiseтАжтАж.with communists. This cannot be done, especially when your opposition has a totalitarian grip on all the necessary levers and is willing to slice your throat and will paint you, successfully, as human trash no matter how decent and fair and compromising you are.
The glibness of Carlson and Trump that people like is not glibness; itтАЩs derisiveness and mockery of the idea that we are just doing normal politics at this point. We are not.
You might have lots of normal friends who still vote for Democrats. ThatтАЩs not who we are up against and that is not who controls the levers. The people controlling the levers are all elite progressive Marxist parasite sacks of shit. This is not a negotiation.
As an example, Mayorkas is not going to secure the border if you compromise and offer amnesty in exchange. HeтАЩs going to take the amnesty and tell you to fuck yourself and keep the border open and ask Congress to raise your taxes to pay for the illiterate gangbangers heтАЩs importing. Then heтАЩll laugh when your daughter gets killed by a drunk driver from El Salvador.
I watched part of the debate with my 96 year old neighbor. She looked at me and said about Pence, and Christy, they both think they're the cock of the walk. Lol.
He acts like he just came down from the mount. ItтАЩs ok if you think youтАЩre better than everyone else, you basically have to if you run for President, but he finds a way to communicate his disdain for normal folks with every long, slow breath he takes.
Yes, as I was listening to Pence last night I viewed him as a humble servant. But upon reflection and reading some comments, IтАЩm of the opinion that he was more arrogant than humble.
His dismissal of Vivek was out of character if one is to believe his devotion to the church and humility.
Yeah, Pence and Christie (and Hailey to some extent) seemed so stale. Their time has passed. I found it especially gross for Pence to take credit for the тАЬTrump Pence administrationтАЭ while also moralizing about his vaunted loyalty to the constitution on January 6th. What he did was a ceremonial action and a no-brainer, and anyone would have done it.
тАЬAnyone would have done itтАЭ there were literally thousands of Trump supporters outside the capital and loads of Trump administration people inside the Whitehouse that were vehemently trying to do the opposite. Give credit where it is due, Pence stood up to his own party, his own President and his own supporters to do the right thing and avoid a constitutional crisis.
As usual I was watching MSNBC and unanimously they believed that DeSantis lost the debate and was a failure. So DeSantis won.
Having a resource like MSNBC that is always the exact opposite of the truth is just as good as having access to the truth.
As Jim Cramer is to investing, MSNBC is to Republican politics.
I couldnтАЩt help but laugh last night thinking about Joe and Mika in high drama form this morning. I used to check in to see them, but I know the first half hour is dedicated to Trump! They sure loved him before 2016!
Remember when Trump would call into the show in 2016 and they were his buds? I do. Then they literally went off the rails......
Yes!! ThatтАЩs what I mean!
According to the WSJ, Pence had a good night. No, really.
hahahahahahaha
I find myself supremely surprised to be in the position of defending Pence, but I thought he did really well. I went into the debate expecting to not even consider him and yet I consistently found myself nodding along to his answers. Even on abortion! I am a GenZ woman and I was shocked that he took a moderate position that many can agree on! I have immense respect for anyone that is willing to put the needs and desires of this country above their own personal beliefs. I like Vivek but honestly, American needs a leader who can work with those they disagree with and I think Vivek showed that heтАЩs not that guy.
To democrats, тАЬwork withтАЭ means тАЬwe roll youтАЭ.
Tired of the suckers.
You and I agree that rolling over your opposition is not productive for this country.
But I think that you are wrong to imply that working across the aisle makes a leader a тАЬsuckerтАЭ. America wonтАЩt survive as a Democracy if we elect someone who sees half of Americans as losers who need to be тАЬre-educatedтАЭ and this applies to BOTH parties.
We all need to remember that Twitter, Substack, and the internet in general, doesnтАЩt represent people at their best. When I walk out my front door, I find that the majority of Americans want to work together.
We absolutely can disagree and still work together. That is the beauty of a free country, we donтАЩt have to hold the same beliefs.
I agree with you that ordinary citizens can agree to disagree without being disagreeable.
My point was more about the RтАЩs in Congress extending their hand to the DтАЩs in good faith, then getting whacked by Pelosi.
The world needs more Gen Zers like you.
Appreciate the support! IтАЩm hopeful that my generation is starting to draw away from hyper polarization. IтАЩve seen a lot more discussion about the effects of constant social media use on our perception of ourselves and each other.
I used to be pretty far left until I took a break for social media and started paying attention to those I encountered in real life. I found that even when I disagreed with someoneтАЩs politics, we could almost always find common ground on our values and hope for this countries future. America is tough, we will find a way forward together.
Glad to read your comments - I'm a late millennial (so a lot older than you) but have always been pretty far to the left. However, one difference I see generationally is that when I was in school, college, etc. we were REGULARLY taught to debate, read, discuss points of view that were really varied and even throughout college we were often asked to defend a position we didn't agree with as way to stregthen our own argument as you say, but also to keep an open mind. So you didn't see words like "full of hate" "fascist" "hater" "supremacist", etc. being tossed around SO lightly like they are today. Which is a VERY dangerous thing. I can disagree with you politically on any position and not "hate" you or wish you harm, or wish your entire reputation and career destroyed over one statement, based on a accusation backed up by the latest Twitter hot-take. That is a VERY dangerous way forward. So I hope Gen Zs like you can help sway the pendulum back to something more reasonable and truly tolerant - social media is here to stay, and I think a lot of what Gen Z has brought forward is GREAT - but you can't be starting fires/wars/and battles all day. At some point, you need to get real things done and that means being practical and TRULY tolerant.
Thanks for posting here!
Millennial here but completely agree. Social media can really warp peopleтАЩs perceptions of real life and I derive a lot of value from having friends on both ends of the aisle. Even when I donтАЩt agree, hearing the other sideтАЩs stance on an issue helps refine mine and IтАЩve even been able to alter other peopleтАЩs thoughts on issues close to me. I have hope too that if we can just get people conversing like humans again, we all stand a chance.
Pence was very annoying IMO and acted like a desperate child.
ItтАЩs really interesting to hear that perspective, since my impression was so different. What moments did you find childish?
Pence was outstanding during the latter part of the debate. National Review expressed amazement that he seemed to be winning it, so counter-intuitive, but he was very strong even if audience hated him.
I thought I was the only person thinking that. Pence to me has always been as exciting as wet toast. He certainly isn't the shiny new thing but in my mind he held his own. I don't care that he found Jesus and I try to look at the complete ticket. Pence/Haley?
DeSantis / Haley. Though Pence talks tough, we have examples of what DeSantis actually did in Florida that were excellent.
His constant talking over the other candidates was very annoying to me. He channeled the worst of Trumps first 2020 debate.
Vivek did the same thing. Repeatedly.
He has a bad habit of talking over the time limit.
The moderators were quite incompetent. In future debates, get rid of he silly bell to signal the end of time. Just turn off the microphone when time's up, that shouldn't be hard.
I thought the same. And that hand-raising thing. I hate that.
ЁЯСНЁЯСН
They wrote that before the debate so they could take the night off?
Pence did have a good night, but he is too earnest for America which prefers the glibness of Trump and Carlson.
I am fine with glib if it can be backed up. But I giggled at your comment (not at you, just the comment) because I find Carlson's earnestness annoying. I like Pompeo's straightforward brand of earnestness.
What?? Why??
I did not see that. I read Pompeo's book though and I liked it and liked him better for it.
PenceтАЩs earnestness that people dislike is his earnest desire to win with decency and integrity and compromiseтАжтАж.with communists. This cannot be done, especially when your opposition has a totalitarian grip on all the necessary levers and is willing to slice your throat and will paint you, successfully, as human trash no matter how decent and fair and compromising you are.
The glibness of Carlson and Trump that people like is not glibness; itтАЩs derisiveness and mockery of the idea that we are just doing normal politics at this point. We are not.
You might have lots of normal friends who still vote for Democrats. ThatтАЩs not who we are up against and that is not who controls the levers. The people controlling the levers are all elite progressive Marxist parasite sacks of shit. This is not a negotiation.
As an example, Mayorkas is not going to secure the border if you compromise and offer amnesty in exchange. HeтАЩs going to take the amnesty and tell you to fuck yourself and keep the border open and ask Congress to raise your taxes to pay for the illiterate gangbangers heтАЩs importing. Then heтАЩll laugh when your daughter gets killed by a drunk driver from El Salvador.
This is not a negotiation.
I agree Kevin.
Too many people canтАЩt see this.
Very scary the ignorance of the electorate.
Pence was more irritating than Chris Crispy, and that takes effort. He takes himself FAR too seriously.
I watched part of the debate with my 96 year old neighbor. She looked at me and said about Pence, and Christy, they both think they're the cock of the walk. Lol.
It was funny when Pence told Vivek тАЬIтАЩll speak slowly so you can understandтАЭ - I donтАЩt think itтАЩs possible for that guy to speak slower.
Wish Vivek would have said "I'd rather you speak faster so you can stop getting buzzed." So incredibly condescending for a guy at 3%
Arrogance doesnтАЩt look good on Pence.
How did Asa Hutchinson get on the stage and Larry Elder didnтАЩt? He was by far the most out of touch and lost on the stage. Embarrassing
Elder is suing because of what happened.
Pence doesnтАЩt need a podium, he needs a pulpit.
So true.
He acts like he just came down from the mount. ItтАЩs ok if you think youтАЩre better than everyone else, you basically have to if you run for President, but he finds a way to communicate his disdain for normal folks with every long, slow breath he takes.
Yes, as I was listening to Pence last night I viewed him as a humble servant. But upon reflection and reading some comments, IтАЩm of the opinion that he was more arrogant than humble.
His dismissal of Vivek was out of character if one is to believe his devotion to the church and humility.
Yeah, Pence and Christie (and Hailey to some extent) seemed so stale. Their time has passed. I found it especially gross for Pence to take credit for the тАЬTrump Pence administrationтАЭ while also moralizing about his vaunted loyalty to the constitution on January 6th. What he did was a ceremonial action and a no-brainer, and anyone would have done it.
тАЬAnyone would have done itтАЭ there were literally thousands of Trump supporters outside the capital and loads of Trump administration people inside the Whitehouse that were vehemently trying to do the opposite. Give credit where it is due, Pence stood up to his own party, his own President and his own supporters to do the right thing and avoid a constitutional crisis.
I agree, the wolfs were in the building and Pence stood strong.