2. The degree of depression after taking puberty blockers
3. The fact that they did not have more control over what was printed by Yoffe
4. This:
"mother withdrew consent for puberty blockers which, they argue, "made everything worse."
She says when her mom revoked consent for the drug, she lost access to counseling with the Washington University transgender care center, which had been crucial to her mental health up until that point. “I was treated amazingly by my counselor,” she wrote. “She was a friend to me and offered a great amount of support.”
It is not the fault of the mother than Washington University withdrew access to the counselor when the mother withdrew consent for puberty blockers. It is the fault of Washington University. Why is getting access to counselling contingent on taking puberty blockers at this clinic?
None of the journalists who are crying foul about this article explore the mother's concerns about the medical and social effects of being put on puberty blockers.
I am sure many parents who have dealt with an anxious, depressed, oppositional teen in the midst of puberty see here a teen who is unable to assess the degree of their own depression. It is very common for teenagers to default to oppositional behavior against at least one parent. Sadly, most of the people unquestionably taking the teenager's side here probably haven't been through the experience of parenting a teenager.
I logged out of twitter three years ago because I found the environment too emotionally loaded and angry.
I saw that tweet too. Most of the tweets are from anonymous accounts. None of these twitter people are required by law to pay for "Casey"/Alex's medical care. None of these twitter people are required by law to act in the best interest of their child to the best of their ability. None of these twitter people will be around in five years when "Casey"/Alex hopefully is accepted to a good university and finds out that paying for university is very expensive. None of these twitter people will be around in 15 or 20 years when "Casey"/Alex starts thinking about starting their own family.
Not saying that "Casey"/Alex will want to have their own children, but the fact that they are talking about adoption means that somewhere vaguely in the back of their mind, they haven't decided not to have children.
I had one or two university friends that absolutely did not want to have children and didn't. But this is not common.
Adopting is very expensive and very difficult. Most people see this or that Hollywood star adopt or have children through donor eggs and surrogacy. What is not mentioned is that the Hollywood star probably paid the birth/surrogate mother an exorbitant sum. Costs of donor eggs and surrogacy are easily in excess of $100K per child.
I am sympathetic to both "Casey"/Alex in this story, and to the mother. To Alex I would say: your mom is likely to be doing her best in a tough situation. She may have made some mistakes. Still, you are young. You can be non-binary without puberty blockers or hormones. I hope you get access to an excellent therapist without having to be on blockers, hormones or surgery. Wishing you the best, Alex.
I would give you triple likes for this comment if I could.
I see a lot of teenagers who can't recognize that they are being victimized. It also appears that the clinic has taken advantage of the different view of the mother versus the father to push an aggressive agenda.
This also happened in a case in Canada where it was the father that didn't want to agree to gender transition, puberty blockers and hormones. The child was twelve or thirteen when they were put, very suddenly, on puberty blockers. In that case, the mother pushed for transition and the father ended up in prison because he violated a publication ban the courts had imposed.
I agree that it has become impossible to rationally talk about this problem in many parts of the US. I live in San Francisco. My state senator is Scott Wiener. Until about a year ago, I highly respected Scott Wiener. If I were to try to have this discussion with him, I am quite sure that he would go off on his usual diatribe and accuse me of being a Trump supporter. (My actual politics: second wave feminist, moderately pro-choice, anti-gun, anti-hardcore pornography, anti-human trafficking, anti-neoliberal, pro-worker, moderately pro-union, pro LGB, pro trans, but not pro drugs and surgery, moderately pro environmental protections. I try to use pronouns of other people. My pronouns: none. In my experience in male dominated workplaces, pronouns increase awareness of sexed based differences.)
Anyway, I am sure that all of this wouldn't matter in Scott Wiener's increasingly us versus them world.
I'm originally from Canada. To escape from all the craziness on this topic in California, I've been following the legal discussions in the UK around gender and sexed based rights very closely. Some UK based legal discussions on twitter worth following:
Investigative Journalist, Author of book Time to Think, an in depth look at the collapse of the London based Tavistock gender service for children
One reason I am following the discussion in the UK is that whatever is decided there will gradually filter out into other countries. In spite of a lot of shouting from organizations like Stonewall UK, the voices in the UK defending women's sex based rights, and the rights of children/teenagers to a high standard of medical care, seem to gradually be getting their voices heard.
It will take time, but sooner or later, even Scott Wiener is going to have to have a rational discussion about the balanced between biologically sex based rights, and gender based rights. He will also have to have a more balanced discussion about the rights of children to a high standard of medical and psychological care, and the rights of parents to help their children without interference from profit driven and ideologically driven agendas.
I agree that substack is one of the few forums where you can have this kind of discussion.
Read the tweets of Alex:
Here is what they disagree with the mother about:
1. The date of onset of depression.
2. The degree of depression after taking puberty blockers
3. The fact that they did not have more control over what was printed by Yoffe
4. This:
"mother withdrew consent for puberty blockers which, they argue, "made everything worse."
She says when her mom revoked consent for the drug, she lost access to counseling with the Washington University transgender care center, which had been crucial to her mental health up until that point. “I was treated amazingly by my counselor,” she wrote. “She was a friend to me and offered a great amount of support.”
It is not the fault of the mother than Washington University withdrew access to the counselor when the mother withdrew consent for puberty blockers. It is the fault of Washington University. Why is getting access to counselling contingent on taking puberty blockers at this clinic?
None of the journalists who are crying foul about this article explore the mother's concerns about the medical and social effects of being put on puberty blockers.
I am sure many parents who have dealt with an anxious, depressed, oppositional teen in the midst of puberty see here a teen who is unable to assess the degree of their own depression. It is very common for teenagers to default to oppositional behavior against at least one parent. Sadly, most of the people unquestionably taking the teenager's side here probably haven't been through the experience of parenting a teenager.
I logged out of twitter three years ago because I found the environment too emotionally loaded and angry.
I saw that tweet too. Most of the tweets are from anonymous accounts. None of these twitter people are required by law to pay for "Casey"/Alex's medical care. None of these twitter people are required by law to act in the best interest of their child to the best of their ability. None of these twitter people will be around in five years when "Casey"/Alex hopefully is accepted to a good university and finds out that paying for university is very expensive. None of these twitter people will be around in 15 or 20 years when "Casey"/Alex starts thinking about starting their own family.
Not saying that "Casey"/Alex will want to have their own children, but the fact that they are talking about adoption means that somewhere vaguely in the back of their mind, they haven't decided not to have children.
I had one or two university friends that absolutely did not want to have children and didn't. But this is not common.
Adopting is very expensive and very difficult. Most people see this or that Hollywood star adopt or have children through donor eggs and surrogacy. What is not mentioned is that the Hollywood star probably paid the birth/surrogate mother an exorbitant sum. Costs of donor eggs and surrogacy are easily in excess of $100K per child.
I am sympathetic to both "Casey"/Alex in this story, and to the mother. To Alex I would say: your mom is likely to be doing her best in a tough situation. She may have made some mistakes. Still, you are young. You can be non-binary without puberty blockers or hormones. I hope you get access to an excellent therapist without having to be on blockers, hormones or surgery. Wishing you the best, Alex.
I would give you triple likes for this comment if I could.
I see a lot of teenagers who can't recognize that they are being victimized. It also appears that the clinic has taken advantage of the different view of the mother versus the father to push an aggressive agenda.
This also happened in a case in Canada where it was the father that didn't want to agree to gender transition, puberty blockers and hormones. The child was twelve or thirteen when they were put, very suddenly, on puberty blockers. In that case, the mother pushed for transition and the father ended up in prison because he violated a publication ban the courts had imposed.
I agree that it has become impossible to rationally talk about this problem in many parts of the US. I live in San Francisco. My state senator is Scott Wiener. Until about a year ago, I highly respected Scott Wiener. If I were to try to have this discussion with him, I am quite sure that he would go off on his usual diatribe and accuse me of being a Trump supporter. (My actual politics: second wave feminist, moderately pro-choice, anti-gun, anti-hardcore pornography, anti-human trafficking, anti-neoliberal, pro-worker, moderately pro-union, pro LGB, pro trans, but not pro drugs and surgery, moderately pro environmental protections. I try to use pronouns of other people. My pronouns: none. In my experience in male dominated workplaces, pronouns increase awareness of sexed based differences.)
Anyway, I am sure that all of this wouldn't matter in Scott Wiener's increasingly us versus them world.
I'm originally from Canada. To escape from all the craziness on this topic in California, I've been following the legal discussions in the UK around gender and sexed based rights very closely. Some UK based legal discussions on twitter worth following:
https://twitter.com/k21fem (Karon Monaghan)
Scottish expert on British employment law. Interested in the balance between sex and gender based equality rights
https://twitter.com/docstockk (Kathleen Stock)
Material Philosopher. Wrote book Material Girl
https://twitter.com/MForstater
Founded organization Sex Matters Council
@michaelpforan
Expert on the British Equality Act
https://twitter.com/HJoyceGender
Ethics advocate for women's sex based rights and for children and teenagers
https://twitter.com/fairplaywomen
Advocate for the protection of women's sport
https://twitter.com/joannaccherry
Scottish Parliamentarian, against gender self ID as she believes it would lead to confusion on the enforcement of women's rights in many areas
https://twitter.com/KemiBadenoch
Conservative Parliamentarian
parents are immigrants from Nigeria.
Hannah Barnes
https://twitter.com/hannahsbee
Investigative Journalist, Author of book Time to Think, an in depth look at the collapse of the London based Tavistock gender service for children
One reason I am following the discussion in the UK is that whatever is decided there will gradually filter out into other countries. In spite of a lot of shouting from organizations like Stonewall UK, the voices in the UK defending women's sex based rights, and the rights of children/teenagers to a high standard of medical care, seem to gradually be getting their voices heard.
It will take time, but sooner or later, even Scott Wiener is going to have to have a rational discussion about the balanced between biologically sex based rights, and gender based rights. He will also have to have a more balanced discussion about the rights of children to a high standard of medical and psychological care, and the rights of parents to help their children without interference from profit driven and ideologically driven agendas.
I agree that substack is one of the few forums where you can have this kind of discussion.
Best to you!