A conversation with the former secretary of state. Plus: George Packer on what Israel can learn from America’s 9/11 response.
I am Jewish and support Israel, but I am sorry Bari, getting Condoleezza Rice or any one else from Bush Jr administration is not helping to build trust for anything.
Bush administration has lied us into Iraq war, we have wasted trillions of $$$, 1000s of Americans died and over 1 million of Iraqis, all based on a lie. By destroying Iraq we have, destroyed Irans biggest regional enemy.
We shouldn't under any case rehabilitate Condoleezza Rice or anyone who supported war in Iraq.
I think at root the conflicts in Israel continue because, and only because. of Useful Idiots in Western media and the academic environments whose propaganda births and nurtures their Very Bad Ideas.
Israel can't and should not grant the Right of Return, which is really the core demand, which amounts to "Let's pretend the 1948 War didn't happen, we didn't root for the other side, the other side didn't lose, and we didn't leave in the meantime while rooting for them. Let's also pretend it is 1948 and we get a reset again, so we can work out better plans for killing all of you that will work this time."
Israel really can't give any more land back without creating a security nightmare. So there is really nothing they can do. There are no concessions they can make, and in practice the '48 refugees don't want any. They want to kill all the Jews in Israel, and go back to 1948.
Obviously, the Israelis cannot grant this, and the refugees cannot force it. Israel is much too powerful to be conquered militarily, particularly since it has nukes and if it had to would unquestionably use them.
So why don't the '48 refugees simply accept a peace deal? This is the billion dollar question. Their children would live better lives, this would lead immediately to economic progress, and in terms of what is physically possible, that is the shortest and best path to getting it.
But their leaders benefit from the situation. Every time they initiate violence and Israel responds, there is a chorus of support in Western media. If a '48 refugee punches an Israel in the nose, it only becomes news if the Israeli punches him back. The rest they don't care about.
If you doubt this, just look at the coverage of the one of the most horrific Horroristic--there is a neologism for you, Horrorism, which is terrorism with decapitated babies--attacks ever. Somehow the focus is STILL on the bombs that seem to have been dropped arbitrarily and for no reason.
So in my view, starting violence and creating violence in response gets people in the West to send money. Various governments send money to the Gazan and West Bank governments. These governments are corrupt, and siphon off much money like Zelensky does.
And the two can be usefully compared. Zelensky is sending tens of thousands of Ukrainian men into a meat grinder or shooting gallery, where they cannot hope either to gain ground or even survive. Why? He is being told to do this by the people sending him money. And if he stops getting money, he stops being able to fund the posh lifestyle that he and his friends have come to enjoy.
There is every reason to suspect the same of no doubt low grade charming and persuasive sociopaths who live in Qatar and elsewhere, whose mansions are funded by money that was sent to "help Palestinians". War is business. And their business is funded by Western governments that are duped by Western media, which refuses to even attempt moral clarity, honest history, or accurate reporting.
I see many condemnations of Israel’s “cruel” treatment of Palestinians, but I want to hear real solutions. What can Israel do differently without compromising security? And why in the world should they stop building settlements in the hope of some theoretical peace deal that the Palestinians clearly do not want?
Pulling war hungry neocon globalists like Condoleezza Rice into the discussion may not be the best look Bari. She's sharp, well informed and convincing, but keep in mind that she was also a huge part of the "yellowcake uranium from Niger" crew that was trotted out by the Bush administration to justify invading and occupying Iraq. Saddam Hussein was a tyrant and killer of his own people, but ask any family member who lost a loved one in Iraq if they think the US invasion was worth it......not to mention the 2.5 trillion it cost american tax payers. But hey.......at least ExxonMobile, 3 Chinese oil companies, & 2 Russian oil companies have a monopoly on the Iraqi oil fields today......so there's that.
That said, its clear you are emotional in your position and rightly so, but Rice is the wrong sounding board IMO.
Finally, when I read Zelensky state “It was very important not to be alone,” I almost laughed out loud. Zelensky has never given two sh*ts about Israel or peace in the middle east. If he didn't think that cuddling up to the Israel cause right now wouldn't get him another huge war chest of US taxpayer funds, you wouldn't hear a mouse fart out of the guy. Oh.......and I'm guessing his Azov commanders are not all that impressed with his new found friend.....just sayin.
I have nothing but contempt for the George Packers of the world. Yes, Isreal, you have a festering problem with a group that wants to kill all of you, shoots rockets into your country, and hides among civilians, but let's tie your hands when dealing with the existential threat. In TGIF, one blurb was on the idiot progressive professors and the idiocy that spews from them. George is a student who more than likely learned at their feet.
Hamas, when planning this assault, counted on the George Packer's of the world. We can act with impunity and hide out. Israel will do what they always do, hit a few buildings, and then pull back because if they come after us, the cost will be too much for the George Packers of the world to handle. And the George Packers are the world's most intelligent people, and if their sensibilities get hurt, we win.
Sadly, the people of Gaza did nothing to create or stop this, but they are in the middle of it. Who will be to blame? Hamas. When civilians die, its because of Hamas; when they starve or die of disease, it's because of Hamas. Every last member of Hamas must either have a conversion to modernity or die. It is for the people of Gaza to see the futility of acting like barbarians and change. We must not go to the Bush years but rather the Truman years. The Allies crushed the Germans and Japanese. Yes, we killed civilians, but those left created new societies from the old ones. For any new peace to happen, the same pattern must occur. Hamas must be utterly destroyed, and the people who are left must see that the old way is no longer viable and change. This policy might hurt George Packer's feelings but is the only path forward.
The most important lesson we can take from 9 11 is that governments will use events to convince people that they need less freedom and the government needs more power.
Sadly hardly anyone has learned that lesson
Trump was masterfully resolving this issue isolating and diminishing Iran and sidelining the Palestinians until a fraudulent election removed him. The uniparty of war is now firmly back in control
In 2006, just as Israel was about to annihilate Hezbollah in Lebanon, Condoleeza Rice swooped in to impose a peace deal. This stupid policy allowed the terrorists to retrench and rebuild.
Then there was Iraq.
Rice, who reminds her audience of her blackness in every speech, is done. She’s done more than enough damage for a lifetime.
Regarding Packer's article, it's hard to avoid killing Palestinian civilians in a gunfight when their terrorist husbands, fathers, and sons are hiding behind them in the midst of it... Terrorists choose not to be bound by the Geneva Convention. They should be treated according to their choices.
Darn. No transcript. And I'm a big fan of Miss Rice. Next.
Condi should keep in mind Jews were there before Christianity and Islam existed. And sure there are “descent” PA authorities but if they will not end Hamas et al then they have no intention of stopping the next attempted genocide.
I’m watching our own government already pressuring Israel for restraint.
But I hope Israel instead decimates enemies entirely.
Good to see Condaleeza Rice speaking, an intelligent and thoughtful woman.
I believe Condoleeza Rice has a fundamental grasp of the intricacies of middle east politics. I particularly appreciated her comment that the first thing on your mind after a horrific attack is not finding blame but keeping your people safe from further damage. I have always admired her.
In contrast to many of the commenters, I appreciated the interview with Dr. Rice. I heard her admit that they did not handle everything perfectly, but no one is perfect. I appreciated her thoughtful perspective on middle eastern history past and present. Based on her intelligence and experience, I think her opinions are beneficial. She led during a very difficult time, and it is easy for people to second guess those actions 20+ years later. Based on many of the comments here, I guess most of the hateful, bloviating people didn’t listen to the interview.
During the Bush years, I was adamantly against anyone in his administration because I was anti-war. I evolved and I like Condeleeza Rice. Thank you for interviewing her on Honestly.
There can be no peace as long as one side cares about humanity and its people and the other see their own people as useful for being killed and hiding among them as targets to further the worldwide propaganda of the idiots in news organizations.
One cares for its people and the other could care less. There is no moral ground for peace.