Rather clumsily I'm trying to make the point that every moral framework has to have an anchor in a faith system. And I mean every moral framework. Secular humanists like to think that they can invent morality (i.e. moral relativism) but if there is no absolute morality then their moral framework is the divine right of Kings to do whateve…
Rather clumsily I'm trying to make the point that every moral framework has to have an anchor in a faith system. And I mean every moral framework. Secular humanists like to think that they can invent morality (i.e. moral relativism) but if there is no absolute morality then their moral framework is the divine right of Kings to do whatever the heck they want ("Might makes right"?). Islam uses the Koran as their faith system, so for them, killing infidels is 'moral'. We rightly regard that as abhorrent, but my subtext is that the reason we find killing innocent foreigners immoral is 2000 years of Christian history. If you had been born in, say, Somalia in the current time, or born back in Roman days pre-Christ, you would find killing foreigners to be good if your warlord or slave master told you to. We don't have a morality without the New Testament - or at least not one that works. So why is what you think to be not ok, not ok? Because Jesus said "Thou shalt not kill", and added that getting in a rage or resenting or unforgiveness is a sin. Anglophone morality is steeped in the practice of Christianity, which is a historical fact. We just don't say that out loud very often because some people might find it 'not inclusive'.
Yes of course. But Jesus quoted Moses as we find it in Matthew's gospel, and then extended it from 'law' to personal application. Critically, without Jesus being born, would not the West still have an eye-for-an-eye and a tooth-for-a-tooth as the fairest justice system? Yes, the whole Bible reveals that judgement is to be tempered with mercy. (David honored King Saul when he could have killed him, for instance. Yet Samuel was outraged that Saul had disobeyed and spared some of the Amalekites.) But Jesus, ministering as a Rabbi, in full agreement with the Torah, taught that "Don't murder" doesn't go far enough. Jesus said that if you hate your brother it's the same guilt as killing him. Our whole Western understanding of justice, forgiveness, reconciliation and restoration are because Christians believe that Jesus fulfilled the Torah and as Isaiah's Suffering Servant, earned the right to become our Savior. But thanks for pointing that out! I'm humbled to be discussing such holy words with you.
Rather clumsily I'm trying to make the point that every moral framework has to have an anchor in a faith system. And I mean every moral framework. Secular humanists like to think that they can invent morality (i.e. moral relativism) but if there is no absolute morality then their moral framework is the divine right of Kings to do whatever the heck they want ("Might makes right"?). Islam uses the Koran as their faith system, so for them, killing infidels is 'moral'. We rightly regard that as abhorrent, but my subtext is that the reason we find killing innocent foreigners immoral is 2000 years of Christian history. If you had been born in, say, Somalia in the current time, or born back in Roman days pre-Christ, you would find killing foreigners to be good if your warlord or slave master told you to. We don't have a morality without the New Testament - or at least not one that works. So why is what you think to be not ok, not ok? Because Jesus said "Thou shalt not kill", and added that getting in a rage or resenting or unforgiveness is a sin. Anglophone morality is steeped in the practice of Christianity, which is a historical fact. We just don't say that out loud very often because some people might find it 'not inclusive'.
Well, you’re wrong since it wasn’t Jesus who said that. G-d said that to Moses way before Jesus was born.
Yes of course. But Jesus quoted Moses as we find it in Matthew's gospel, and then extended it from 'law' to personal application. Critically, without Jesus being born, would not the West still have an eye-for-an-eye and a tooth-for-a-tooth as the fairest justice system? Yes, the whole Bible reveals that judgement is to be tempered with mercy. (David honored King Saul when he could have killed him, for instance. Yet Samuel was outraged that Saul had disobeyed and spared some of the Amalekites.) But Jesus, ministering as a Rabbi, in full agreement with the Torah, taught that "Don't murder" doesn't go far enough. Jesus said that if you hate your brother it's the same guilt as killing him. Our whole Western understanding of justice, forgiveness, reconciliation and restoration are because Christians believe that Jesus fulfilled the Torah and as Isaiah's Suffering Servant, earned the right to become our Savior. But thanks for pointing that out! I'm humbled to be discussing such holy words with you.