The big ivy-league schools well represented. As impressive as they all are-and they are- it would be more impressive to have included a few from other schools. Even at least one. What about the college in Austin you promoted so passionately in an episode of Honestly?
This whole debate is specious and dumb. Three points:
1. These interns represent a diverse geography: the Midwest, the South, the West, and both coasts. So to claim that they are somehow a cohort of “coastal elites” is clearly untrue.
2. That said, who the fuck cares what region they represent? If what we care about is the willingness to engage in uncomfortable conversations, argue unpopular opinions, and seek the truth no matter how inconvenient or messy it is, then Geographical Representation shouldn’t matter. Checking a box for “regional diversity” is as useless as it sounds.
3. If we are committed to meritocracy, if we want the best and brightest, then we are (typically) going to find them at Elite Institutions like Ivy League universities. And if you’re convinced that these places are rife with Red Guards enforcing ideological conformity then that makes these students all the more impressive for their willingness to go against the grain, take unpopular opinions and risk ostracism.
Also, go read Julia’s piece on living on a commune in Montana, it’s illuminating and amusing
I learned more in one summer while interning at an engineering firm than 3 years of undergraduate study. It was my first experience in real projects that were going to be built. I was exposed to client interaction, budgets, environmental constraints, permitting …, things the University didn’t have time to include in the curriculum yet directly influence every project I’ve worked on.
I empathize with the commenters you replied to, but I hope that everyone appreciates that the interns too will learn from working in the real world. Bari and Nellie appreciate the value of the comments offered by all subscribers. I believe that the comments offered and the freedom to do so granted by TFP is why it has been so successful. We are all teachers.
Gabriel, Abigail, Michael, Evan, Julia, welcome to TFP. There is much to learn.
Seems to have pushed a hot button for you. Your language is unnecessarily angry.
Look again and carefully at this cohort, and they are a cohort of representation, many with aspirations to become lawyers who hope to write or run coffee shops someday. Wow. There is no suggestion of affirmative action in this thread by many here who are long-time contributors to the comments section; just the point that the best and brightest are not always in the elite institutions. On the contrary.
Yes, I could have paused and cooled off before responding. Apologies.
I still stand by the core of the argument though. There is a grueling gauntlet of high achievement and extraordinary performance that is, generally, required to make it into the top tier educational institutions. While not a perfect metric, its an incredibly useful filter to narrow the pool of applicants, and for very busy people with hundreds (or thousands) of applicants it is simply a necessity to make quick judgments with limited data.
Please don’t think that I’m saying that talent and drive are limited to the Ivy League. Of course it can be found elsewhere, but that’s a harder, longer, more personalized search, one that will require TFP to be a larger organization that can delegate to long established staff members. They simply aren’t there yet.
For the time being, what matters is having highly competent, driven, energetic young talent that is committed to pursuing and publishing news grounded in facts and evidence.
This cohort seems like they are well suited for that task, I wish them all the best.
You can forage for food in the woods or you can go to the grocery store. What you’re looking for is available in both places, but only one is guaranteed to reliably give you what you want without wasting a lot of your time
Thank you, Matthew, no apologies necessary. I understand your argument but still don’t agree with it, but it seems many people do. That’s what this space is all about, and there is very good dialogue in the comments here. I still think TFP missed the boat on this one, especially in light of part of their title, which stated “Meet our Future Bosses”, while humbly nodding to the collegiate accomplishments of these fine interns also bows to an exclusive club of the hierarchy that are groomed to become bosses. There is a double-edged sword here.
I disagree. The experience of someone living in a commune doesn’t compare to the experience of kids from W VA whose parents lost their jobs in the mines and have been dirt poor since. It is these voices we need to hear more of.
Yes. People who live in communes have what I call "chosen poverty." Like someone who goes to prison overnight to see what it feels like. Living on a commune may get you ready for hard physical labor & it may be a good education in decision-making, especially if it's by consensus, but when you could leave at any time & Uber back to Poshville, you don't occupy the same cultural territory as someone who cannot escape poverty without a monumental effort.
Well. Not monumental for everyone, but certainly more concerted than gathering your Let's Go Europe & your brand-new backpack & calling Uber. And yes, monumental for some. It may mean going back to school or getting a second job or learning a new trade or moving to another part of the country & leaving the life you knew. Those are big things. From the comfort of Poshville I guess you think everything is easy peasy.
That’s a fair point, one that made it hard to take the book Nickled and Dimed as serious as the author would have wished.
However, I’m still not seeing the relevance to doing hard-hitting investigative journalism. The qualifications should be based on temperament and track record of excellence. Top tier schools do the heavy lifting to sort out the highest performing young people, that is one of the biggest values they provide. At the stage of TFP’s growth they are shrewd to use those credentials as a metric.
Can we call it pseudo-trolling? I like to think it there is always an underlying point involved. Perhaps I'm self aggrandizing, though.
As far as the Appalachian kid, I would like to hear that, too. Unfortunately, the odds of that happening are exponentially small....because they are lazy, stupid, prone to violence and immoral.
I hear what you’re saying and for opinion pieces that would be an interesting and worthwhile perspective to hear. I disagree that what you are describing would make someone any better at investigative reporting, which is ultimately what we’re after here.
Should not going to an Ivy League be a disqualification? No, of course not. But given the need for, two-very-overworked-new-moms to narrow down a large pool (hundreds? thousands?) of applicants quickly with limited data, using educational credentials as a filter is the logical approach.
When the organization grows can they take more time to find talent from less traditional sources? Sure. Until then, I trust that they are doing the best they can with the limited resources they have.
Matthew, These interns look and sound amazing in their experience and excitement for interning at the Freepress. I am excited to see what they do - especially the young man who quoted CS Lewis (non main stream thinking). I would say, the one criticism is not the diversity of regions - but diversity of thought. Stanford, Princeton and other Ivies (or ivy like) are infected with a group think that is antithetical to the Freepress. They should hire the best and the brightest but some consideration should be given to the the indoctrination mills that Universities have become. Hey Bari, next year get an intern from Hillsdale College - you might find a gem.
I think the "diversity of thought" aspect, obvious though it is to sentient folks, was simply lost on Corson-Finnerty. He mistook the label of "coastal elite" as being essentially about geography and not actual experience and exposure (both in growing up and in avoiding leftist indoctrination in academe). He also falls prey to the common belief of the Left that "the best and brightest" come from these sorts of institutions. As though no one from the rest of America could possibly be full of talent and potential.
Good observations. Plus I am not sure coastal elites means where they come from or where they are geographically, but rather where they aspire to be. At least mentally. I know a few coastal elites in Austin.
Yes, indeed. And that best and brightest moniker ... I think we had a book many decades ago by a fella named Halberstam who reviewed the impact of such anointed intellects in the 60s when Camelot was running the country. Hubris and intellectual conceit brought the team and much of the country low. In Vietnam and other realms. Enough, already, with looking for the best and the brightest. Look for competence, a profound sense of what greatness in leadership comes out of, and a truly open mind. Ivies, etc., are a false god. I know. I was once one of them.
Rob we’re actually in agreement here, if the goal is to find folks who can stand up for truth-telling in the face of rigid ideological conformity, then this is a particularly bold group for the very fact that they are coming from places that are increasingly intolerant to the views they publicly hold.
These are precisely the free-thinking, indoctrination-resistant people we’d want to be interning at the Free Press!
I disagree. By choosing only from elitist schools, is like breeding in the same gene pool. Pretty soon all of the offspring look alike and have the same birth defects.
Students of highly-selective, elite universities are more alike than they are different, simply because of the screening regime. High end suburban high schools and prep schools don't differ that much from each other nationwide. "Diverse geography" means exactly nothing here.
These are all lovely young people, but I don't think it requires "best and brightest" credentials to be an intern, for god's sake. This is not a professional sport, it need not be a competition in which the same, highly-prepared, highly-talented individuals win all the prizes. If an internship is supposed to be about affecting people's lives in ways they might never have been able to imagine (as Bari describes it was for her), having more "regular people" from non-Ivy-equivalent schools who aren't going to law school or getting MBA's or doing post-graduate scholarships might fulfill that mission better. The search for prairie talent is worth doing.
When I hear "best and brightest" I think of Halberstam. Google it.
Even superior students from a public high school of today lack a grounding in the fundamentals of writing and mathematics. I would suggest, also, that even the best students graduating today only have passing knowledge of the sciences. And, history? How many today can explain why the Pilgrims went to the Netherlands or the significance of Custer's Last Stand?
I hear you, but can you see how this is (more or less) the argument underpinning affirmative action? If we want the most qualified people for any given position it will create deeply unfair circumstances, with barriers that are incredibly difficult to overcome. That is a harsh reality.
I don’t think any of us can reasonably expect Bari and Nellie not to allow the elite credentialing process to do the heavy-lifting for them in their candidate searches. It’s two literally two people running this show. Two very overworked, very tired new moms. I trust their decision.
Let’s see what these young people can crank out before we jump to conclusions about the supposed deleterious effects of their upbringings.
I’m not advocating for some kind of quota. I’m only saying that this is a very large country and that a deeper search might produce a different set of potential interns. “Most qualified” means nothing in this context. There is no scale here, it’s a matter of judgment. These interns are very bright accomplished people and they will do a great job. Still, other sets of interns could be made of equally bright accomplished people, rather like Harvard could put together many freshman classes of students with perfect SATs. Some of them might not be Ivy educated would-be lawyers and it would be good not to screen those out.
Both my grandparents were newspaper writers in the late 1930’s and 40’s.Neither had college degrees which was the norm back then.My grandmother left school at 14 and made her way in “a man’s world”.There are a million ways to get an education but to ignore the contribution of folks who go outside the ivory towers is a mistake.Please include some other kinds of diversity and thought while expanding your search for young talent.These young people look wonderful and accomplished but only when they get out of those institutions will their metal be tested in real life.Good luck.
besides it might be nice for them to work along side of the hoi polloi .. I am sure they are nice people. but really. where re the ones who do NOT want to lawyers and own coffee shops..at least none said they wanted to be politicians ( yet)..
I wouldn't exactly categorize Bari and her team as the hoi polloi, but I would categorize them as honest, hard-working individuals with collective idea and an ethic to return credibility to journalism.
Give them a couple of years, and we will find that they have eaten significantly into the hegemony claimed by the NY Times and the Washington Post.
Here's hoping more choose to follow in their footsteps.
They may have grown up in different regions, but they all attended elite coastal universities, and there is no indication they grew up in anything but elite families. Those of us who are or have been poor are painfully aware that those who have never been poor have ZERO idea about what life is actually like living in poverty. Those who grew up in cities have no idea about what life is actually like in the vast rural parts of America. Without that perspective, there is much that will be missed by their eyes, simply because they don't understand what they're looking at.
I saw only ONE of these interns--Ms. Anthony--who has already PROVEN her willingness to stand up against ideological conformity. I sincerely hope that these interns truly have the willingness to do objective journalism. I'm not, however, holding my breath.
Frankly, in this day and age simply being an intern at TFP and associated with Bari would be enough to make a student “radioactive” to many of their peers. It wouldn’t surprise me if some of them have already been baselessly accused of being racist/fascist/white supremacist.
Additionally, at least two of them are on the record pushing back against the groupthink. I imagine the rest have made their independent thinking clear to their peers formally or informally as well.
I would not be at all surprised if assumptions and judgments were made about the schools I attended. Because the reality is that schools have reputations, and they don't get those reputations out of nowhere.
I attended a religious university that was difficult to get into in my youth, and I guarantee that judgments would be made about that.
When I went back to college in my 30s, I got my bachelor's degree from a small Midwestern college that didn't have an M.A. program. I got my M.A. from Midwestern state university that didn't have a PhD program. I fully expect that judgments would be made--many of them inaccurate--about my experiences there.
But what seems very, very clear is that if I were a young person seeking an internship, I would NOT have been on FP's short list, regardless of the quality of my writing or my devotion to the more objective style of journalism, simply because I didn't go to the "proper" university. And that bothers me a lot.
Interns are usually not paid and rents are high in LA (if that is where the office is located)...how could a young student struggling with debt afford this opportunity?
Seems like Bari's introduction stated plainly that it was the paying subscribers who made it possible for FP to hire these interns. So I don't think it's logical to assume that they are unpaid interns.
It sounds as if you are arguing that only those from wealthy families SHOULD be able to get internships. While that is likely the sad reality of many internships (unpaid interns are becoming the rule, even in institutions that consider themselves "Woke"), I would hate to think that FP is perpetuating that system.
No, gave the wrong impression. I saw a close family member struggle to meet the demands of her program which involved several internships across the US and for a few weeks at a time. It was a budget chewer with rent, transportation, etc. A friend supported her son as he interned for a prestigious NYC bank. While scholarships can cover or reduce tuition, the internships required expensive loans. In my opinion, the ability to work as an unpaid intern is one of those subtle barriers to the working class because it keeps the internship off the resume.
Hoping that you are correct and the interns are making money or getting some kind of financial break. It should be paid work!
Uh, did you see the schools they went to? These are clearly elites. Also, the fact that you think merit is only found at Ivy League universities indicates that you have blinders on.
How does an overworked duo of sleep deprived new parents whittle down a large pool of applicants? By filtering it along reliable metrics of proven performance. This is an essential component of the value proposition of elite institutions: they filter talent/ambition/intelligence/competence for you.
Could they find hidden gems of talent in the community colleges of America? Of course, but that’s a laborious undertaking that’s just not realistic for an organization of this size.
Again, what really matters here is the interns’ ability to think independently and challenge ideological conformity and report truthfully, all of which seem very capable of doing just that.
For one thing, "Coastal" is a state of mind more than a geography. Unless you consider Chicago to be on the coast of Illinois.
I certainly hope they are willing to engage in uncomfortable conversations--that Bari hired them is a point in their favor--but these days, the big universities aren't known for that. Being editor of a newspaper geared toward young & inexperienced students who all think the same thing is not the real world & not the place where they are likely to have gotten the pushback they may get here. So I hope it's illuminating for them.
Yes we are committed to meritocracy, but there's a reason the Senate & the House represent in two very different ways.
Okay, I hear you saying that this is about culture, not geography. That despite the fact that they are from all over the country, that is less important than the state of mind they possess.
So, how do you judge their state of mind?
Do these seem like folks who’ve been indoctrinated into ideological conformity? Do they seem like they have been cowed into not speaking their minds?
Of course not. They are already demonstrably willing to push back against groupthink and argue unpopular opinions. On the record. At their universities.
Viewing a world-class education as a liability instead of an incredible asset is a foolish and short-sighted inversion of value.
There are very bright and capable students at pretty much all schools even if some schools have more than others. A true commitment to meritocracy would not almost exclusively pull from the most exclusive schools because so many of those ivy league students do not get in solely on merit, they get on legacy (read privilege). That college admissions scandal and subsequent lawsuits against Harvard and UNC made that very clear.
I have two sons that that are App State grads, but probably not good candidates for TFP internship programs. Yes, these interns are very impressive young people. As I told my students, "Go forth and do great things!"
I had planned to add a comment just like this. By their nature they attract bright kids but also kids from a certain mindset. What about a large midwestern public uni? Or, some other ideas... a community college or someone who, gasp, hasn't been to college at all but had great and productive high school and real world experiences? Some of those young people have the most Common Sense (😉) of all.
One of the greatest journalists and humorist of the 20th century, H. L. Mencken never went to college, neither did Mark Twain or Hemingway. I could go on and on as some of you know, I am wont to do but you get the idea.
Outstanding point although these students and their expressions are an inspiration to all of us concerned about the exercise of our First Amendment rights. The Ivy League is overrated by the political-media elites. These youngsters are breaking loose from the narrative we are fed everyday. They will flourish with THe Free Press.
That's fair and was essentially my point, though poorly worded.
So, do you think it's likely achieve that diversity from a group of coastal elites or would it be more likely if one were from Ohio St. another from Texas A&M yet another from Boise St then one from Stanford and one from Brown?
I've thought about this for a while and I realize I don't really care where they come from. It's more important to me they be people who think independently, have common sense, are brave enough to speak up for their beliefs, and think about the ramifications of their beliefs. After all, ideas have consequences and bad ideas have victims, so when people have ideas and beliefs they should be considering the ramifications of their beliefs. I don't think most of our politicians look beyond the horizon or even think about how their ideas will pan out in the real world. My hope is that this summer with Bari and the TFP team will develop and awareness in each of these young people and they will be able to share that with others of their generation.
"'Ive thought about this for a while and I realize I don't really care where they come from."
We are all a product of our experiences. If you were culled from thousands of applicants to go to a highly selective, elite school. The culling process discards all those applicants that don't meet the school's standards. In other words cookie cutter students.
I agree the intern class this year looks like east and west coast elites. I wonder just how interested midwestern university students would be in moving to LA for the summer for an internship though. These might be the only schools that have students who would be interested and can afford to go anywhere in CA for a summer internship. My internship (in 1975!) was in NYC and there was one Penn grad (out of 8), one PAC-10 and the rest were from Big 10 schools.
I think you would be selling short the midwestern university students. It is a great opportunity that they have missed out on-not elite enough I guess.
I suppose it is a slippery slope to the long-term success of TFP as it gains solid traction, but it seems they’re creating an anti-coven (which is just more of the same old fight) rather than leading the new way.
That was my thought as I read the article. If FP wants diversity of ideas, choose some interns from a small rural university, like Hillsdale College or Stephen F. Austin in Nacogdoches, Texas. I'm sure out if SFA's thousands of students there are motivated, smart students that would love to work at FP.
By only hiring interns from elitist universities makes FP look like elitist snobs. For all I know, FP is run by elitist snobs.
None of the critics of the academic backgrounds of these interns knows what the applicant pool actually looked like or has a clue about how college internship recruiting actually works. Anyway, best of luck to these interns. I look forward to reading their content.
Life is not about finding equitable distribution across some notion of objective categories. We started this whole charade when we began to give our children trophies for participating in activities around their towns. It needs to stop. If we want to build a true culture of mutual support, that needs to be modeled at the individual level by taking a person under your care whom you believe has potential and lacks either the resources or family support to reach their goals. All this nonsense about schools and regions and races and genders is just another participation trophy for a generation that sorely needs to learn how to accept the struggle that his life.
We have torn down so many of the positive attributes that we found in faith based communities, and we are now trying to rebuild that on the fly with an overreaching fundamentalism.
It is not at all about equitable distribution, affirmative action or any of the above. It is about mining the gold in all places, not just elite schools, though possibly these may very well be the last of the free-thinking graduates. The elite and the Ivys are all turning their attention toward woke policies and will most likely churn out a different type of person altogether pretty soon.
My hope, and the only hope that is probably sustainable, is that people will start to pay closer attention to reality. There’s a very good piece in Substack today about the fatigue around the gender wars. Expert systems of governance require a tremendous amount of policing and compliance to be sustained. We have good evidence of this “intimidation-based consensus” coming out of the Covid response. That is why most tyrannical responses fail overtime. I saw an intern from Maryland, and perhaps these undiscovered gems can navigate up through our sorting system, because there is no easy way to find them if they lack the chutzpah and initiative to make themselves findable.
I agree to a point, and I'm sure TFP were flooded with applications, so perhaps not so difficult to find their way in as to be chosen. I don't know what the process was, so that is purely based on speculation and what can be seen in the article.
That was my first thought as I scrolled through these credentials: where are the top students from non-Ivy-league schools? Students who have climbed by their merits instead of whatever wealth or connections or oppression points it takes to get into the Ivies?
I appreciate your turn of phrase regarding “wealth connections or oppression points.” I agree with much of the sentiment expressed by others about the lack of academic diversity. And as a father of two extremely intelligent boys, I fear what doors may forever be closed to them because of the absence of wealth connections and oppression points in their lives.
I was thinking the same thing! My alma mater - Minnesota State University is a highly regarded midwestern college......and the students are all corn-fed-fly-over-country-natives. A great perspective that needs more attention. I hear way too much from the elite-college crowd.........
Perhaps the conversation shouldn't revolve around which schools these kids come from, it's basically who these people are and their talent. In other words, are they courageous? Can they avoid self censure? Can they stand scrutiny and peer abuse?
And, just as important - can they write? Most high mark high school grads enter university (Ivy or not) not knowing a comma from a semi-colon, not able to structure a sentence or even an essay, or when to move on to the next paragraph.
I'm thinking that if these interns are any good, it wasn't the school they went to that made them that way. They had a gift before they got there..
Maybe these 5 were simply most qualified, independent of their schools? I don't think of FP as a DEI hub. Each one sounds like an excellent and refreshing choice for FP's mission.
I echo your sentiments, Nuance. I was a journalist in print and broadcast in the 70s and 80s, and was taught objectivity was the most important component in everything outside of op-ed. My biggest complaint with today's media is the blatant bias exhibited by news outlets, as exhibited by their word choices, failures to interview and include more than one side of an issue, author bias skewing and and reliance on anonymous sources. None of that would have flown at any of the media outlets where I worked. TFP may not be perfect, but Bari is trying to bring stories to us that others ignore, many times because the story doesn't reflect that outlet's own biases. It's a shame and it makes us both dumber and angrier.
I am interested in reading about people, movements and events that I don't agree with so I have insight into everyone's points of view. This is why I subscribe to TFP. I don't have to love every story, and I certainly don't take offense if the story reflects the opposite of my personally held beliefs. I'm not here to occupy an echo chamber.
Welcome to these these young interns. I look forward to seeing their contributions. TFP has been the source of some amazing journalism and you have the opportunity to add to its legacy. As for the comments, there are some brilliant commenters here who argue their points with passion and insight. I've learned a lot reading through what they have to say. I think you will, too.
Yes, it’s so pleasing to see these enthusiastic young interns. A lot of commenters seem to bear a grudge against them for coming from Ivy League universities. To be a happy, healthy bright young person with good fortune is a blessing from God. There is no need to hold them back in any way just for the sake of “fairness”.
lol then why'd you respond? Pretty prejudice viewpoint, bud. Next we should tell Bari she can't hire people from underprivileged areas too. Wouldn't want a skewed perspective, you know?
You seemed to have missed the point. Most of us want diverse perspectives, a different take so to speak.
These kids seem like bright independent thinkers but do they come from a background where the environment isn't formed from hard left ideologies? You can get bright kids who graduate from a small middle of the road universities. We are asking FP to cast a broader net. Where is the harm in that?
You’re missing the point. Prejudice is prejudice. And not for nothin, but you can’t know how broad a net was cast just because you don’t like the mixture of fish it brought back up.
And most want to become LAWYERS. We certainly don't need anymore of them charging $500/hour. Heck the great majority of the Democrat Party are lawyers and look at where that's got us.
We probably need more conservative lawyers -- Alliance Defending Freedom, Federalist Society, etc. If they can maintain their values through law school, that is.
I read today that Kevin Costner's divorce lawyer charges $1,000 per hour with a $25,000 retainer. I've heard that the top lawyers in NYC charge $2,000 per hour. The article doesn't say whether or what these interns are being paid but several of them may be looking for the big bucks further on in life.
Why be embarrassed? $1,000 per hour is pure greed and obscene. You can clearly see why only the rich in this country can afford good legal counsel. The rest of us are screwed.
Just when I was congratulating myself on NOT sharing my opinion of A&M our of respect for you, here you go spitting on my profession. Everybody hates lawyers until they need one. Then you should hear the poor, poor, pitiful lamentations.
You have my sympathy. I don't know what you need one for but a little tip (unless it is for family law). Experienced lawyers have learned a lot in their field so they charge high hourly rates. That means you get a big bang for your buck but also that they can do the job in less time, sometimes a lot less time, than a cheaper, albeit inexperienced one.
I'm sorry but the average person like me CANNOT AFFORD $500-$1,000 per hour. I'm a Registered Professional Nurse 50 years with 2 Master's degrees and I'm not even close to $100 per hour. That's why attorneys are only for the wealthy.
My best friend from A&M is our lawyer and every year at the annual Chamber of Commerce dinner he would give $50.00 to anyone who told the best lawyer joke.
It doesn't matter what school. Listen to these impressive young people. They are diverse in their interests and talents. They are committed to excellent journalism. They are braver than most everyone here. I wish them all the best. And if this internship program is a success, word will get out and it will result in more competition from students from all schools. Give them space and save the criticism until we see how this rolls... And by the way, there are lots of reasons to study law that have nothing to do with becoming a lawyer.
What Running Burning Man fsils to recognize is the bravery needed to face the prospect of losing friends, fanily, connections and work prospects because the world you come from has been overrun with illiberal thinking.
The only people who have a problem with academics and ntellectuals are traditionally fascists and communists. Running diesn't realize that he is just the other side of the 'woke' militant coin. A hardline support for affirmative action is no different to what he's doing here. In his eyes, some folks are more deserving and more equal than others. People who are 'privileged' need to be discriminated against according to him. Merit be damned.
Excellent that the FP is nurturing interns, particularly in free thinking and being advocates for freedom of expression. The world more than ever needs insightful journos and authors in general.
What inspiring young people you've brought on board. I'm envious of them, and can't wait to see their work. Thank you for training the next generation of writers and thinkers, and for prioritising open-minded, evidence-led journalism.
I think I would enjoy meeting these people. I like that they are attempting to escape the conformity they encounter at their respective universities. I like that they have already openly criticized woke critics. I also like that they are channeling their idealism to reestablish more thoughtful dialog above important tropics, ignoring the approved narrative, looking for truth. The future is not so dim as it seemed.
It takes incredible courage to go against the accepted ideology and lack of free speech on college campuses today, especially elite schools where many students already think they know everything. I applaud these interns.
Give them a chance. They seem open to hearing and understanding differing points of view. Not everyone who goes to an Ivy is an ideological enemy. Most are, perhaps, but let's engage with the ones who profess to be open-minded.
"When it comes to the number of lawyers per capita globally, the United States easily has the lead. There are more lawyers per capita in the United States than in any other country. In the United States, there are 1.26 million lawyers. Most lawyers are centered in New York, with California and Florida close behind. Statistics show one lawyer for every 248 residents in the United States."
Historically coffee shops have been the place where people go to talk. There have even been attempts to ban them. The more we have the better for our democracy.
Bari - two thoughts, after first offering thanks and congratulations on the success of the Free Press.
First, much like the very gifted interns I interview for our law firm's internships, these young women and men are accomplished and gifted. They are also - at least from appearances - all from successful families. Have you ever considered a hard scrabble kid from Appalachia or the rural South or Midwest for the internship program? Just a thought. Might loosen up your urban sensibilities a bit.
Second, consider turning loose young Ms. Anthony. Anyone who has the guts to take on the Soviet group think at a Ivy League re-education camp and call out such stupidity is someone to "keep an eye on." But all the interns seem bright and talented. Perhaps try this daily exercise with them - read the lead editorial from the NY Times. Get rid of any that don't howl with laughter and derision.
Bruce, I agree completely. I was most impressed with the young ex-ballerina. Her essay regarding the Princeton Ballet Club’s ridiculous, incoherent adoption of DEI and forced compliance was hard-hitting, incisive, and courageous. She will be some one to watch.
Channeling Richard Nixon, let me say this about that: I was one of those hardscrabble kids from Appalachia, and while it had its moments, that "lived experience," as they say nowadays, was a double-edged sword. As I look back, I cannot recall all the numbers of times I embarrassed myself - always the prickly ex coal miner, picking fights that I didn't need to pick, not fitting in with my colleagues, clearly an outsider in my class and proud of it, deficient in general knowledge, deficient in cultural information. On the plus side, when the psych professors told us that parents had no right to ask their children to take care of them, we had a knock-down drag-out fight in front of the whole class and I never backed down. That Appalachian "raisin'" made me very comfortable with who I was and with what was right and wrong.
So these interns' "privileged" backgrounds have tremendous advantages - I would submit, far more than disadvantages, and certainly in some ways a leg-up on the Working Class Hero upbringing. Let's hope they can leverage those advantages into knowledgeable adulthoods.
The working class background doesn't necessarily limit one to a specific region. Many working class kids from Queens or Long Island have vastly different upbringings and opportunities than kids from wealthier towns. All I was pointing out was that a resume padded with "accomplishments" that are due more to parental wealth and guidance needs a more careful examination and a net cast more widely is bound to bring in better fish.
Bruce! May be a first in my reading, but as a former working class kid from Queens, state university educated, etc. I totally agree with you! I often think that most of the chatter at FP is too focused on political divides that are sustained (by elites on both sides of the aisle) to keep us all from focusing one of the real threats to our country, growing disparity in wealth — the classic haves and have nots, and when the have nots eventually decide it to just take it from the haves. Best regards, Steve
Maybe next you could open an office in Wichita or Sioux Falls or Laramie and hire some 40 year old freelancers who have been going to city council meetings and running small businesses.
These are all sharp kids I’m sure but I think American society in general has maybe had enough coastal elitism and credentialism, guys.
This is one of the noblest and most magnanimous things you can do, Bari. It's not just creating a legacy, it's giving back to an institution at large that has been generous to you. These bright young people are the essential core of the rewrite much of our society desperately needs. Bravo!
I'm reading thinking wow, a bright group, and wanting to engage facts, not feelings. That's encouraging. And then I got to the last line and chuckled out loud. "One day, I’d like to own a coffee shop in a quaint coastal town." Isn't that what we all ultimately want in some form. An uncomplicated little corner of the world, kids, spouse, or not...good books to read, good food to eat and some modicum of safety and freedom to pursue our passions?
How did life become so complicated? Anyway, I would like to see a state school represented. Univ of Texas, FL, etc.
First reaction is the same as many others - hmmm..... Then I reflect on the lesson taught by the U.S. Supreme Court last week: judge everyone as an individual. Let us hope that these future leaders have absorbed very little from their formerly-great schools - and like Ms. Weiss - absorb a lot from experience in the Real World.
Really glad to see you hired Abigail Anthony. She's been a rare profile in courage during her time at Princeton. I'll look forward to hearing more from her in the future!
Welcome interns! As to the critics, let's not make the mistake of putting identity before substance. Isn't rejection of that approach one of the reasons we love Free Press? Let's see what these people can do!
The decision focused on race and both the Civil Rights Act and Equal Protection clause. Geographic diversity hasn't been applied to either to the best of my knowledge.
The big ivy-league schools well represented. As impressive as they all are-and they are- it would be more impressive to have included a few from other schools. Even at least one. What about the college in Austin you promoted so passionately in an episode of Honestly?
How about Appalachian State? More from flyover country please.
This whole debate is specious and dumb. Three points:
1. These interns represent a diverse geography: the Midwest, the South, the West, and both coasts. So to claim that they are somehow a cohort of “coastal elites” is clearly untrue.
2. That said, who the fuck cares what region they represent? If what we care about is the willingness to engage in uncomfortable conversations, argue unpopular opinions, and seek the truth no matter how inconvenient or messy it is, then Geographical Representation shouldn’t matter. Checking a box for “regional diversity” is as useless as it sounds.
3. If we are committed to meritocracy, if we want the best and brightest, then we are (typically) going to find them at Elite Institutions like Ivy League universities. And if you’re convinced that these places are rife with Red Guards enforcing ideological conformity then that makes these students all the more impressive for their willingness to go against the grain, take unpopular opinions and risk ostracism.
Also, go read Julia’s piece on living on a commune in Montana, it’s illuminating and amusing
I learned more in one summer while interning at an engineering firm than 3 years of undergraduate study. It was my first experience in real projects that were going to be built. I was exposed to client interaction, budgets, environmental constraints, permitting …, things the University didn’t have time to include in the curriculum yet directly influence every project I’ve worked on.
I empathize with the commenters you replied to, but I hope that everyone appreciates that the interns too will learn from working in the real world. Bari and Nellie appreciate the value of the comments offered by all subscribers. I believe that the comments offered and the freedom to do so granted by TFP is why it has been so successful. We are all teachers.
Gabriel, Abigail, Michael, Evan, Julia, welcome to TFP. There is much to learn.
Such a lovely comment!
Agreed, life itself is an invaluable ongoing education.
Seems to have pushed a hot button for you. Your language is unnecessarily angry.
Look again and carefully at this cohort, and they are a cohort of representation, many with aspirations to become lawyers who hope to write or run coffee shops someday. Wow. There is no suggestion of affirmative action in this thread by many here who are long-time contributors to the comments section; just the point that the best and brightest are not always in the elite institutions. On the contrary.
Yes, I could have paused and cooled off before responding. Apologies.
I still stand by the core of the argument though. There is a grueling gauntlet of high achievement and extraordinary performance that is, generally, required to make it into the top tier educational institutions. While not a perfect metric, its an incredibly useful filter to narrow the pool of applicants, and for very busy people with hundreds (or thousands) of applicants it is simply a necessity to make quick judgments with limited data.
Please don’t think that I’m saying that talent and drive are limited to the Ivy League. Of course it can be found elsewhere, but that’s a harder, longer, more personalized search, one that will require TFP to be a larger organization that can delegate to long established staff members. They simply aren’t there yet.
For the time being, what matters is having highly competent, driven, energetic young talent that is committed to pursuing and publishing news grounded in facts and evidence.
This cohort seems like they are well suited for that task, I wish them all the best.
"Please don’t think that I’m saying that talent and drive are limited to the Ivy League." That's exactly what you're saying.
You can forage for food in the woods or you can go to the grocery store. What you’re looking for is available in both places, but only one is guaranteed to reliably give you what you want without wasting a lot of your time
Thank you, Matthew, no apologies necessary. I understand your argument but still don’t agree with it, but it seems many people do. That’s what this space is all about, and there is very good dialogue in the comments here. I still think TFP missed the boat on this one, especially in light of part of their title, which stated “Meet our Future Bosses”, while humbly nodding to the collegiate accomplishments of these fine interns also bows to an exclusive club of the hierarchy that are groomed to become bosses. There is a double-edged sword here.
I disagree. The experience of someone living in a commune doesn’t compare to the experience of kids from W VA whose parents lost their jobs in the mines and have been dirt poor since. It is these voices we need to hear more of.
Yes. People who live in communes have what I call "chosen poverty." Like someone who goes to prison overnight to see what it feels like. Living on a commune may get you ready for hard physical labor & it may be a good education in decision-making, especially if it's by consensus, but when you could leave at any time & Uber back to Poshville, you don't occupy the same cultural territory as someone who cannot escape poverty without a monumental effort.
I agree. It seems to me, anyone who lives in a commune is more than a just a little left wing nut case.
What?!!
It takes monumental effort to escape poverty? Now is that for all of them, or just certain ones?
You sound woke.
Well. Not monumental for everyone, but certainly more concerted than gathering your Let's Go Europe & your brand-new backpack & calling Uber. And yes, monumental for some. It may mean going back to school or getting a second job or learning a new trade or moving to another part of the country & leaving the life you knew. Those are big things. From the comfort of Poshville I guess you think everything is easy peasy.
Well played sir, well played
That’s a fair point, one that made it hard to take the book Nickled and Dimed as serious as the author would have wished.
However, I’m still not seeing the relevance to doing hard-hitting investigative journalism. The qualifications should be based on temperament and track record of excellence. Top tier schools do the heavy lifting to sort out the highest performing young people, that is one of the biggest values they provide. At the stage of TFP’s growth they are shrewd to use those credentials as a metric.
This is off topic, a defeat for the anti-free speech Democrats/Socialists and a triumph for the First Amendment.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/ny-times-roasted-for-complaining-biden-can-t-fight-disinformation-after-judge-s-ruling/ar-AA1dtern?ocid=msedgntp&cvid=e9c30eb7c3e84ebfbf9cd59d0c43621c&ei=28
Everything should be allowed on social media. No restrictions.
After I read your post, I fell to the floor clutching my heart. My wife called EMS. When they got here I told them I was OK.
I told them the reason I fell to the floor was because I read you post and we agreed on something. The shock was too much for me.
Yip that’s the heart and soul of America those are “the people” I think Bari has given “them a wide berth”.
Why?
They should just work harder, overcome, and go to an elite university.
I know you’re trolling, but I’d be super impressed by, and very interested in hearing from, an Appalachian kid who graduated from an Ivy
Can we call it pseudo-trolling? I like to think it there is always an underlying point involved. Perhaps I'm self aggrandizing, though.
As far as the Appalachian kid, I would like to hear that, too. Unfortunately, the odds of that happening are exponentially small....because they are lazy, stupid, prone to violence and immoral.
Damn....I did it again!
There is so much truth in your comment! I think it is lost on the Weiss Sisters, however.
I hear what you’re saying and for opinion pieces that would be an interesting and worthwhile perspective to hear. I disagree that what you are describing would make someone any better at investigative reporting, which is ultimately what we’re after here.
Should not going to an Ivy League be a disqualification? No, of course not. But given the need for, two-very-overworked-new-moms to narrow down a large pool (hundreds? thousands?) of applicants quickly with limited data, using educational credentials as a filter is the logical approach.
When the organization grows can they take more time to find talent from less traditional sources? Sure. Until then, I trust that they are doing the best they can with the limited resources they have.
Matthew, These interns look and sound amazing in their experience and excitement for interning at the Freepress. I am excited to see what they do - especially the young man who quoted CS Lewis (non main stream thinking). I would say, the one criticism is not the diversity of regions - but diversity of thought. Stanford, Princeton and other Ivies (or ivy like) are infected with a group think that is antithetical to the Freepress. They should hire the best and the brightest but some consideration should be given to the the indoctrination mills that Universities have become. Hey Bari, next year get an intern from Hillsdale College - you might find a gem.
I think the "diversity of thought" aspect, obvious though it is to sentient folks, was simply lost on Corson-Finnerty. He mistook the label of "coastal elite" as being essentially about geography and not actual experience and exposure (both in growing up and in avoiding leftist indoctrination in academe). He also falls prey to the common belief of the Left that "the best and brightest" come from these sorts of institutions. As though no one from the rest of America could possibly be full of talent and potential.
Good observations. Plus I am not sure coastal elites means where they come from or where they are geographically, but rather where they aspire to be. At least mentally. I know a few coastal elites in Austin.
Yes, indeed. And that best and brightest moniker ... I think we had a book many decades ago by a fella named Halberstam who reviewed the impact of such anointed intellects in the 60s when Camelot was running the country. Hubris and intellectual conceit brought the team and much of the country low. In Vietnam and other realms. Enough, already, with looking for the best and the brightest. Look for competence, a profound sense of what greatness in leadership comes out of, and a truly open mind. Ivies, etc., are a false god. I know. I was once one of them.
Rob we’re actually in agreement here, if the goal is to find folks who can stand up for truth-telling in the face of rigid ideological conformity, then this is a particularly bold group for the very fact that they are coming from places that are increasingly intolerant to the views they publicly hold.
These are precisely the free-thinking, indoctrination-resistant people we’d want to be interning at the Free Press!
The very fact these interns come from “elite” institutions of ideological capture and they have not succumbed is powerful. And incredibly hopeful.
"Might find"....but won't.
You're arguing for DEI.
I disagree. By choosing only from elitist schools, is like breeding in the same gene pool. Pretty soon all of the offspring look alike and have the same birth defects.
Does that go for natural selection in the polecat population, too?
Students of highly-selective, elite universities are more alike than they are different, simply because of the screening regime. High end suburban high schools and prep schools don't differ that much from each other nationwide. "Diverse geography" means exactly nothing here.
These are all lovely young people, but I don't think it requires "best and brightest" credentials to be an intern, for god's sake. This is not a professional sport, it need not be a competition in which the same, highly-prepared, highly-talented individuals win all the prizes. If an internship is supposed to be about affecting people's lives in ways they might never have been able to imagine (as Bari describes it was for her), having more "regular people" from non-Ivy-equivalent schools who aren't going to law school or getting MBA's or doing post-graduate scholarships might fulfill that mission better. The search for prairie talent is worth doing.
When I hear "best and brightest" I think of Halberstam. Google it.
Really good points, thank you!
I have to differ with you on that.
Even superior students from a public high school of today lack a grounding in the fundamentals of writing and mathematics. I would suggest, also, that even the best students graduating today only have passing knowledge of the sciences. And, history? How many today can explain why the Pilgrims went to the Netherlands or the significance of Custer's Last Stand?
What is the significance of Custer’s last stand? (I ask out of genuine curiosity)
I hear you, but can you see how this is (more or less) the argument underpinning affirmative action? If we want the most qualified people for any given position it will create deeply unfair circumstances, with barriers that are incredibly difficult to overcome. That is a harsh reality.
I don’t think any of us can reasonably expect Bari and Nellie not to allow the elite credentialing process to do the heavy-lifting for them in their candidate searches. It’s two literally two people running this show. Two very overworked, very tired new moms. I trust their decision.
Let’s see what these young people can crank out before we jump to conclusions about the supposed deleterious effects of their upbringings.
I’m not advocating for some kind of quota. I’m only saying that this is a very large country and that a deeper search might produce a different set of potential interns. “Most qualified” means nothing in this context. There is no scale here, it’s a matter of judgment. These interns are very bright accomplished people and they will do a great job. Still, other sets of interns could be made of equally bright accomplished people, rather like Harvard could put together many freshman classes of students with perfect SATs. Some of them might not be Ivy educated would-be lawyers and it would be good not to screen those out.
Both my grandparents were newspaper writers in the late 1930’s and 40’s.Neither had college degrees which was the norm back then.My grandmother left school at 14 and made her way in “a man’s world”.There are a million ways to get an education but to ignore the contribution of folks who go outside the ivory towers is a mistake.Please include some other kinds of diversity and thought while expanding your search for young talent.These young people look wonderful and accomplished but only when they get out of those institutions will their metal be tested in real life.Good luck.
besides it might be nice for them to work along side of the hoi polloi .. I am sure they are nice people. but really. where re the ones who do NOT want to lawyers and own coffee shops..at least none said they wanted to be politicians ( yet)..
I wouldn't exactly categorize Bari and her team as the hoi polloi, but I would categorize them as honest, hard-working individuals with collective idea and an ethic to return credibility to journalism.
Give them a couple of years, and we will find that they have eaten significantly into the hegemony claimed by the NY Times and the Washington Post.
Here's hoping more choose to follow in their footsteps.
no not Bari.. those others who may have applied without the "cred" of the "social elite"
They may have grown up in different regions, but they all attended elite coastal universities, and there is no indication they grew up in anything but elite families. Those of us who are or have been poor are painfully aware that those who have never been poor have ZERO idea about what life is actually like living in poverty. Those who grew up in cities have no idea about what life is actually like in the vast rural parts of America. Without that perspective, there is much that will be missed by their eyes, simply because they don't understand what they're looking at.
I saw only ONE of these interns--Ms. Anthony--who has already PROVEN her willingness to stand up against ideological conformity. I sincerely hope that these interns truly have the willingness to do objective journalism. I'm not, however, holding my breath.
Frankly, in this day and age simply being an intern at TFP and associated with Bari would be enough to make a student “radioactive” to many of their peers. It wouldn’t surprise me if some of them have already been baselessly accused of being racist/fascist/white supremacist.
Additionally, at least two of them are on the record pushing back against the groupthink. I imagine the rest have made their independent thinking clear to their peers formally or informally as well.
Lots of assumptions and judgement here based solely on the schools they come from. Hope you have not been the recipient of a similar POV.
I would not be at all surprised if assumptions and judgments were made about the schools I attended. Because the reality is that schools have reputations, and they don't get those reputations out of nowhere.
I attended a religious university that was difficult to get into in my youth, and I guarantee that judgments would be made about that.
When I went back to college in my 30s, I got my bachelor's degree from a small Midwestern college that didn't have an M.A. program. I got my M.A. from Midwestern state university that didn't have a PhD program. I fully expect that judgments would be made--many of them inaccurate--about my experiences there.
But what seems very, very clear is that if I were a young person seeking an internship, I would NOT have been on FP's short list, regardless of the quality of my writing or my devotion to the more objective style of journalism, simply because I didn't go to the "proper" university. And that bothers me a lot.
Interns are usually not paid and rents are high in LA (if that is where the office is located)...how could a young student struggling with debt afford this opportunity?
Seems like Bari's introduction stated plainly that it was the paying subscribers who made it possible for FP to hire these interns. So I don't think it's logical to assume that they are unpaid interns.
It sounds as if you are arguing that only those from wealthy families SHOULD be able to get internships. While that is likely the sad reality of many internships (unpaid interns are becoming the rule, even in institutions that consider themselves "Woke"), I would hate to think that FP is perpetuating that system.
No, gave the wrong impression. I saw a close family member struggle to meet the demands of her program which involved several internships across the US and for a few weeks at a time. It was a budget chewer with rent, transportation, etc. A friend supported her son as he interned for a prestigious NYC bank. While scholarships can cover or reduce tuition, the internships required expensive loans. In my opinion, the ability to work as an unpaid intern is one of those subtle barriers to the working class because it keeps the internship off the resume.
Hoping that you are correct and the interns are making money or getting some kind of financial break. It should be paid work!
Uh, did you see the schools they went to? These are clearly elites. Also, the fact that you think merit is only found at Ivy League universities indicates that you have blinders on.
How does an overworked duo of sleep deprived new parents whittle down a large pool of applicants? By filtering it along reliable metrics of proven performance. This is an essential component of the value proposition of elite institutions: they filter talent/ambition/intelligence/competence for you.
Could they find hidden gems of talent in the community colleges of America? Of course, but that’s a laborious undertaking that’s just not realistic for an organization of this size.
Again, what really matters here is the interns’ ability to think independently and challenge ideological conformity and report truthfully, all of which seem very capable of doing just that.
Ooh, someone got triggered.
For one thing, "Coastal" is a state of mind more than a geography. Unless you consider Chicago to be on the coast of Illinois.
I certainly hope they are willing to engage in uncomfortable conversations--that Bari hired them is a point in their favor--but these days, the big universities aren't known for that. Being editor of a newspaper geared toward young & inexperienced students who all think the same thing is not the real world & not the place where they are likely to have gotten the pushback they may get here. So I hope it's illuminating for them.
Yes we are committed to meritocracy, but there's a reason the Senate & the House represent in two very different ways.
Okay, I hear you saying that this is about culture, not geography. That despite the fact that they are from all over the country, that is less important than the state of mind they possess.
So, how do you judge their state of mind?
Do these seem like folks who’ve been indoctrinated into ideological conformity? Do they seem like they have been cowed into not speaking their minds?
Of course not. They are already demonstrably willing to push back against groupthink and argue unpopular opinions. On the record. At their universities.
Viewing a world-class education as a liability instead of an incredible asset is a foolish and short-sighted inversion of value.
I hope you are right. How we judge their state of mind is easy. We read what they have to say.
Harsh and unnecessary.
Harsh I can concede, unnecessary I cannot
Very good points MCF. Diversity doesn't matter. Merit does.
There are very bright and capable students at pretty much all schools even if some schools have more than others. A true commitment to meritocracy would not almost exclusively pull from the most exclusive schools because so many of those ivy league students do not get in solely on merit, they get on legacy (read privilege). That college admissions scandal and subsequent lawsuits against Harvard and UNC made that very clear.
I have two sons that that are App State grads, but probably not good candidates for TFP internship programs. Yes, these interns are very impressive young people. As I told my students, "Go forth and do great things!"
"flyover country" is a pejorative term.
Well, the first intern profiled is from my alma mater -- this is looking good :)
I had planned to add a comment just like this. By their nature they attract bright kids but also kids from a certain mindset. What about a large midwestern public uni? Or, some other ideas... a community college or someone who, gasp, hasn't been to college at all but had great and productive high school and real world experiences? Some of those young people have the most Common Sense (😉) of all.
One of the greatest journalists and humorist of the 20th century, H. L. Mencken never went to college, neither did Mark Twain or Hemingway. I could go on and on as some of you know, I am wont to do but you get the idea.
It’s not what Bari and Nellie are looking for. They want the green people not the fed people.
I followed your analogy thru 'green' but wasn't sure about 'fed'. Can you help me understand that?
Correction red people
Thank you. Can I assume you are referencing politics?
Yip you can assume it 💯 🇺🇸
Outstanding point although these students and their expressions are an inspiration to all of us concerned about the exercise of our First Amendment rights. The Ivy League is overrated by the political-media elites. These youngsters are breaking loose from the narrative we are fed everyday. They will flourish with THe Free Press.
Completely agree. As impressive as this group is, and they are impressive, the 'ivy league' nature of their schools lacks diversity to say the least.
I'm not concerned by the diversity of the interns' schools or birthplaces, I'm more interested in their diversity of thought and beliefs.
Exactly!
That's fair and was essentially my point, though poorly worded.
So, do you think it's likely achieve that diversity from a group of coastal elites or would it be more likely if one were from Ohio St. another from Texas A&M yet another from Boise St then one from Stanford and one from Brown?
I've thought about this for a while and I realize I don't really care where they come from. It's more important to me they be people who think independently, have common sense, are brave enough to speak up for their beliefs, and think about the ramifications of their beliefs. After all, ideas have consequences and bad ideas have victims, so when people have ideas and beliefs they should be considering the ramifications of their beliefs. I don't think most of our politicians look beyond the horizon or even think about how their ideas will pan out in the real world. My hope is that this summer with Bari and the TFP team will develop and awareness in each of these young people and they will be able to share that with others of their generation.
"'Ive thought about this for a while and I realize I don't really care where they come from."
We are all a product of our experiences. If you were culled from thousands of applicants to go to a highly selective, elite school. The culling process discards all those applicants that don't meet the school's standards. In other words cookie cutter students.
Or no gypsies or thieves need apply....
Especially Texas A&M, class of '67.
lol
Amen!
I agree. I was hoping for a broader representation.
I agree the intern class this year looks like east and west coast elites. I wonder just how interested midwestern university students would be in moving to LA for the summer for an internship though. These might be the only schools that have students who would be interested and can afford to go anywhere in CA for a summer internship. My internship (in 1975!) was in NYC and there was one Penn grad (out of 8), one PAC-10 and the rest were from Big 10 schools.
I think you would be selling short the midwestern university students. It is a great opportunity that they have missed out on-not elite enough I guess.
I suppose it is a slippery slope to the long-term success of TFP as it gains solid traction, but it seems they’re creating an anti-coven (which is just more of the same old fight) rather than leading the new way.
As a WESTERN STATE lawyer, I can vouch for the abundance of brainpower west of the Delaware River.
That was my thought as I read the article. If FP wants diversity of ideas, choose some interns from a small rural university, like Hillsdale College or Stephen F. Austin in Nacogdoches, Texas. I'm sure out if SFA's thousands of students there are motivated, smart students that would love to work at FP.
By only hiring interns from elitist universities makes FP look like elitist snobs. For all I know, FP is run by elitist snobs.
It is LP, snobs and privilege people.
skim the articles read the comments. that's what I do. especially the last one on the "lizard people"
In reading the comments, I have one thing to say
"FOOD FIGHT!"
Bluto Blutarsky
:-)
Thanks for this humor! I can just picture us!
None of the critics of the academic backgrounds of these interns knows what the applicant pool actually looked like or has a clue about how college internship recruiting actually works. Anyway, best of luck to these interns. I look forward to reading their content.
Life is not about finding equitable distribution across some notion of objective categories. We started this whole charade when we began to give our children trophies for participating in activities around their towns. It needs to stop. If we want to build a true culture of mutual support, that needs to be modeled at the individual level by taking a person under your care whom you believe has potential and lacks either the resources or family support to reach their goals. All this nonsense about schools and regions and races and genders is just another participation trophy for a generation that sorely needs to learn how to accept the struggle that his life.
We have torn down so many of the positive attributes that we found in faith based communities, and we are now trying to rebuild that on the fly with an overreaching fundamentalism.
It is not at all about equitable distribution, affirmative action or any of the above. It is about mining the gold in all places, not just elite schools, though possibly these may very well be the last of the free-thinking graduates. The elite and the Ivys are all turning their attention toward woke policies and will most likely churn out a different type of person altogether pretty soon.
My hope, and the only hope that is probably sustainable, is that people will start to pay closer attention to reality. There’s a very good piece in Substack today about the fatigue around the gender wars. Expert systems of governance require a tremendous amount of policing and compliance to be sustained. We have good evidence of this “intimidation-based consensus” coming out of the Covid response. That is why most tyrannical responses fail overtime. I saw an intern from Maryland, and perhaps these undiscovered gems can navigate up through our sorting system, because there is no easy way to find them if they lack the chutzpah and initiative to make themselves findable.
I agree to a point, and I'm sure TFP were flooded with applications, so perhaps not so difficult to find their way in as to be chosen. I don't know what the process was, so that is purely based on speculation and what can be seen in the article.
would be interesting to know how many did apply and where they came from
I like this ms.
I expressed a similar sentiment but you did so more eloquently.
That was my first thought as I scrolled through these credentials: where are the top students from non-Ivy-league schools? Students who have climbed by their merits instead of whatever wealth or connections or oppression points it takes to get into the Ivies?
I appreciate your turn of phrase regarding “wealth connections or oppression points.” I agree with much of the sentiment expressed by others about the lack of academic diversity. And as a father of two extremely intelligent boys, I fear what doors may forever be closed to them because of the absence of wealth connections and oppression points in their lives.
I was thinking the same thing! My alma mater - Minnesota State University is a highly regarded midwestern college......and the students are all corn-fed-fly-over-country-natives. A great perspective that needs more attention. I hear way too much from the elite-college crowd.........
Perhaps the conversation shouldn't revolve around which schools these kids come from, it's basically who these people are and their talent. In other words, are they courageous? Can they avoid self censure? Can they stand scrutiny and peer abuse?
And, just as important - can they write? Most high mark high school grads enter university (Ivy or not) not knowing a comma from a semi-colon, not able to structure a sentence or even an essay, or when to move on to the next paragraph.
I'm thinking that if these interns are any good, it wasn't the school they went to that made them that way. They had a gift before they got there..
Maybe these 5 were simply most qualified, independent of their schools? I don't think of FP as a DEI hub. Each one sounds like an excellent and refreshing choice for FP's mission.
Best of luck to these interns. So glsd Free Press and Bari are nurturing the next wave of free thinkers.
I echo your sentiments, Nuance. I was a journalist in print and broadcast in the 70s and 80s, and was taught objectivity was the most important component in everything outside of op-ed. My biggest complaint with today's media is the blatant bias exhibited by news outlets, as exhibited by their word choices, failures to interview and include more than one side of an issue, author bias skewing and and reliance on anonymous sources. None of that would have flown at any of the media outlets where I worked. TFP may not be perfect, but Bari is trying to bring stories to us that others ignore, many times because the story doesn't reflect that outlet's own biases. It's a shame and it makes us both dumber and angrier.
I am interested in reading about people, movements and events that I don't agree with so I have insight into everyone's points of view. This is why I subscribe to TFP. I don't have to love every story, and I certainly don't take offense if the story reflects the opposite of my personally held beliefs. I'm not here to occupy an echo chamber.
Welcome to these these young interns. I look forward to seeing their contributions. TFP has been the source of some amazing journalism and you have the opportunity to add to its legacy. As for the comments, there are some brilliant commenters here who argue their points with passion and insight. I've learned a lot reading through what they have to say. I think you will, too.
Yes, it’s so pleasing to see these enthusiastic young interns. A lot of commenters seem to bear a grudge against them for coming from Ivy League universities. To be a happy, healthy bright young person with good fortune is a blessing from God. There is no need to hold them back in any way just for the sake of “fairness”.
" A lot of commenters seem to bear a grudge against them for coming from Ivy League universities" Nah! we just see through the bullshit!
Stanford, Princeton, Brown (FFS!), Vanderbilt - only one one from a public college. WTF, are you attempting to build the NYT? Maybe WaPo?
You need to get out more Weiss. Hanging around the salons of the intellectual elites will doom anything related to free speech.
As long as they’re free thinkers who gives a shit what college they went to?
Obviously, a lot of folks give such a shit. Bari Weiss should, too. You we don’t really concern ourselves with.
lol then why'd you respond? Pretty prejudice viewpoint, bud. Next we should tell Bari she can't hire people from underprivileged areas too. Wouldn't want a skewed perspective, you know?
You seemed to have missed the point. Most of us want diverse perspectives, a different take so to speak.
These kids seem like bright independent thinkers but do they come from a background where the environment isn't formed from hard left ideologies? You can get bright kids who graduate from a small middle of the road universities. We are asking FP to cast a broader net. Where is the harm in that?
You’re missing the point. Prejudice is prejudice. And not for nothin, but you can’t know how broad a net was cast just because you don’t like the mixture of fish it brought back up.
Are you saying you don't want to cast a broad net. We should just look at the elite schools?
If they come from environments dominated by the hard Left, it is all the more impressive that they have spit out the Kool-Aid.
Here’s the “free thinkers” that Brown produces: https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/community-family/forty-percent-of-brown-university-students-say-they-are-lgbt-suggesting-social-contagion
And most want to become LAWYERS. We certainly don't need anymore of them charging $500/hour. Heck the great majority of the Democrat Party are lawyers and look at where that's got us.
We probably need more conservative lawyers -- Alliance Defending Freedom, Federalist Society, etc. If they can maintain their values through law school, that is.
$500 per hour?
Pikers.
Agreed. My outside counsel charges $1,000 per hour.
I read today that Kevin Costner's divorce lawyer charges $1,000 per hour with a $25,000 retainer. I've heard that the top lawyers in NYC charge $2,000 per hour. The article doesn't say whether or what these interns are being paid but several of them may be looking for the big bucks further on in life.
Some NYC lawyers were charging $1000/hr a decade ago.
As a retired midwest lawyer, I'm embarrassed at how low my hourly rate was compared to the heavy hitters.
Why be embarrassed? $1,000 per hour is pure greed and obscene. You can clearly see why only the rich in this country can afford good legal counsel. The rest of us are screwed.
Those of us who remember licking a stamp will get this:
The postal service has recalled all stamps that have the face of a lawyer on it.
People don't know what side of the stamp to spit on.
Just when I was congratulating myself on NOT sharing my opinion of A&M our of respect for you, here you go spitting on my profession. Everybody hates lawyers until they need one. Then you should hear the poor, poor, pitiful lamentations.
Who can afford one? Not me.
You have my sympathy. I don't know what you need one for but a little tip (unless it is for family law). Experienced lawyers have learned a lot in their field so they charge high hourly rates. That means you get a big bang for your buck but also that they can do the job in less time, sometimes a lot less time, than a cheaper, albeit inexperienced one.
I'm sorry but the average person like me CANNOT AFFORD $500-$1,000 per hour. I'm a Registered Professional Nurse 50 years with 2 Master's degrees and I'm not even close to $100 per hour. That's why attorneys are only for the wealthy.
My best friend from A&M is our lawyer and every year at the annual Chamber of Commerce dinner he would give $50.00 to anyone who told the best lawyer joke.
I like lawyer jokes and have a sense of humor. It is the constant derision of lawyers without humor I object too.
Yip we in the crap big time!
It doesn't matter what school. Listen to these impressive young people. They are diverse in their interests and talents. They are committed to excellent journalism. They are braver than most everyone here. I wish them all the best. And if this internship program is a success, word will get out and it will result in more competition from students from all schools. Give them space and save the criticism until we see how this rolls... And by the way, there are lots of reasons to study law that have nothing to do with becoming a lawyer.
I think Fox is filled with the same graduates of the schools you mentioned..
What Running Burning Man fsils to recognize is the bravery needed to face the prospect of losing friends, fanily, connections and work prospects because the world you come from has been overrun with illiberal thinking.
The only people who have a problem with academics and ntellectuals are traditionally fascists and communists. Running diesn't realize that he is just the other side of the 'woke' militant coin. A hardline support for affirmative action is no different to what he's doing here. In his eyes, some folks are more deserving and more equal than others. People who are 'privileged' need to be discriminated against according to him. Merit be damned.
I am impressed by these young people. They give me hope for the future.
Excellent that the FP is nurturing interns, particularly in free thinking and being advocates for freedom of expression. The world more than ever needs insightful journos and authors in general.
What inspiring young people you've brought on board. I'm envious of them, and can't wait to see their work. Thank you for training the next generation of writers and thinkers, and for prioritising open-minded, evidence-led journalism.
I think I would enjoy meeting these people. I like that they are attempting to escape the conformity they encounter at their respective universities. I like that they have already openly criticized woke critics. I also like that they are channeling their idealism to reestablish more thoughtful dialog above important tropics, ignoring the approved narrative, looking for truth. The future is not so dim as it seemed.
It takes incredible courage to go against the accepted ideology and lack of free speech on college campuses today, especially elite schools where many students already think they know everything. I applaud these interns.
Hmmmm. But for one, all from elite schools. And most considering law as a career. Does this represent a diversity of opinions?
Give them a chance. They seem open to hearing and understanding differing points of view. Not everyone who goes to an Ivy is an ideological enemy. Most are, perhaps, but let's engage with the ones who profess to be open-minded.
"When it comes to the number of lawyers per capita globally, the United States easily has the lead. There are more lawyers per capita in the United States than in any other country. In the United States, there are 1.26 million lawyers. Most lawyers are centered in New York, with California and Florida close behind. Statistics show one lawyer for every 248 residents in the United States."
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/lawyers-per-capita-by-country
If you shake a bush three lawyers will fall out.
“The first thing we do is, let’s kill all the lawyers.” Act IV, Scene II of William Shakespeare’s Henry VI, Part II
And with the four hundred million weapons we have in this country, Shakespeare’s maxim may well come true. One day.
Dear Julia, continue writing and also own the coffee shop because you will eventually learn, if not already, coffee is life 😊 ☕️
Historically coffee shops have been the place where people go to talk. There have even been attempts to ban them. The more we have the better for our democracy.
My thoughts exactly. Hahaha!
Bari - two thoughts, after first offering thanks and congratulations on the success of the Free Press.
First, much like the very gifted interns I interview for our law firm's internships, these young women and men are accomplished and gifted. They are also - at least from appearances - all from successful families. Have you ever considered a hard scrabble kid from Appalachia or the rural South or Midwest for the internship program? Just a thought. Might loosen up your urban sensibilities a bit.
Second, consider turning loose young Ms. Anthony. Anyone who has the guts to take on the Soviet group think at a Ivy League re-education camp and call out such stupidity is someone to "keep an eye on." But all the interns seem bright and talented. Perhaps try this daily exercise with them - read the lead editorial from the NY Times. Get rid of any that don't howl with laughter and derision.
Bruce, I agree completely. I was most impressed with the young ex-ballerina. Her essay regarding the Princeton Ballet Club’s ridiculous, incoherent adoption of DEI and forced compliance was hard-hitting, incisive, and courageous. She will be some one to watch.
The DEI thugs are anything but inclusive.
Channeling Richard Nixon, let me say this about that: I was one of those hardscrabble kids from Appalachia, and while it had its moments, that "lived experience," as they say nowadays, was a double-edged sword. As I look back, I cannot recall all the numbers of times I embarrassed myself - always the prickly ex coal miner, picking fights that I didn't need to pick, not fitting in with my colleagues, clearly an outsider in my class and proud of it, deficient in general knowledge, deficient in cultural information. On the plus side, when the psych professors told us that parents had no right to ask their children to take care of them, we had a knock-down drag-out fight in front of the whole class and I never backed down. That Appalachian "raisin'" made me very comfortable with who I was and with what was right and wrong.
So these interns' "privileged" backgrounds have tremendous advantages - I would submit, far more than disadvantages, and certainly in some ways a leg-up on the Working Class Hero upbringing. Let's hope they can leverage those advantages into knowledgeable adulthoods.
The working class background doesn't necessarily limit one to a specific region. Many working class kids from Queens or Long Island have vastly different upbringings and opportunities than kids from wealthier towns. All I was pointing out was that a resume padded with "accomplishments" that are due more to parental wealth and guidance needs a more careful examination and a net cast more widely is bound to bring in better fish.
Bruce! May be a first in my reading, but as a former working class kid from Queens, state university educated, etc. I totally agree with you! I often think that most of the chatter at FP is too focused on political divides that are sustained (by elites on both sides of the aisle) to keep us all from focusing one of the real threats to our country, growing disparity in wealth — the classic haves and have nots, and when the have nots eventually decide it to just take it from the haves. Best regards, Steve
Understood.
You bring an excellent point - it's about class - too often these people are from wealthy backgrounds rather than working class.
Maybe next you could open an office in Wichita or Sioux Falls or Laramie and hire some 40 year old freelancers who have been going to city council meetings and running small businesses.
These are all sharp kids I’m sure but I think American society in general has maybe had enough coastal elitism and credentialism, guys.
I live in Manhattan for many years, and I sincerely agree with this.
Hi Mike Sweeney. Nice to see you back. I touted your substack last week in connection with autism commentary on the FP.
This is one of the noblest and most magnanimous things you can do, Bari. It's not just creating a legacy, it's giving back to an institution at large that has been generous to you. These bright young people are the essential core of the rewrite much of our society desperately needs. Bravo!
I'm reading thinking wow, a bright group, and wanting to engage facts, not feelings. That's encouraging. And then I got to the last line and chuckled out loud. "One day, I’d like to own a coffee shop in a quaint coastal town." Isn't that what we all ultimately want in some form. An uncomplicated little corner of the world, kids, spouse, or not...good books to read, good food to eat and some modicum of safety and freedom to pursue our passions?
How did life become so complicated? Anyway, I would like to see a state school represented. Univ of Texas, FL, etc.
The University of Maryland is a state school.
First reaction is the same as many others - hmmm..... Then I reflect on the lesson taught by the U.S. Supreme Court last week: judge everyone as an individual. Let us hope that these future leaders have absorbed very little from their formerly-great schools - and like Ms. Weiss - absorb a lot from experience in the Real World.
Really glad to see you hired Abigail Anthony. She's been a rare profile in courage during her time at Princeton. I'll look forward to hearing more from her in the future!
Welcome interns! As to the critics, let's not make the mistake of putting identity before substance. Isn't rejection of that approach one of the reasons we love Free Press? Let's see what these people can do!
Agreed, checking a box for “regional diversity” is as dumb as it sounds
Yes, and ironic considering the SCOTUS ruling on Affirmative Action.”
I doubt a quest for regional diversity would transgress the Students for Fair Admissions decision.
The merit argument? Quotas (in effect)?
The decision focused on race and both the Civil Rights Act and Equal Protection clause. Geographic diversity hasn't been applied to either to the best of my knowledge.
Point taken. But do you see the parallel?