The couple were unprepared for parenthood when the mother to be was only 26? Her career was in jeopardy? Ugh! After decades of feminist activism, it still her career that takes the hit? Raising children is damned hard and expensive and wonderful and a blessing. And it still mostly takes two to tango. Where was the father in all this? Why wasn’t his career jeopardized in any way?
My kids were born in Seattle in 1976 and '79. I took them hiking often. I taught them self-reliance and the importance of diet and exercise. I worked hard at stopping their whining.
Now they are in their forties and both have had plenty of adventures. Neither is married or has children or a house. Too expensive. My daughter does have a car.
The economy and society in the USA today are very tough for younger generations.
The human race is always only 45 years from extinction.
Thanks (once again) for bold stories in the face of victim-mentality! Raised as the oldest child of young parents (21 and 26) and then being an adoptive mom (at 36 and 40) of two (now) grown children I realized that waiting until the “ideal” time for babies is way over-rated. But being a parent is not!
We raised five children who are good citizens who have served their country and community.
They have raised twelve children-all good students, hard workers and good citizens with none of the crazy upside down cultural nonsense we witness everyday.
Late to the party again... for anyone willing to listen: One of my many tiresome tropes is that we are no longer designed to match our environment. Behold the age at which we are fertile. It corresponds far better to our period of ability to survive parenting than does waiting until midlife when we've finally managed to convince ourselves that we're Really Ready. For reasons painful to relate I did not lay the keels of children until 31 and 38. The former kinda late, the latter really late. You are more able than you think.
I applaud Steven Rinella. It's a father's job to teach kids the tough lessons. Men instinctively understand tough love. Mom's, not so much. I love women and
Being a parent is the toughest thing I've ever done. I was 42 when my daughter was born. When she was 4, I was born again one afternoon when I called on Jesus to be my Savior. Since then, the teaching of Jesus has served as my guide for raising her. I tell her, God is love and if you don't know love you don't know God. I believe our country is in the shape its in because the word of God has disappeared from so many homes. I guess we could call it a falling away.
Seed of Abraham: My point is that since Jesus didn't get married or have children He can't know what it is really like. I don't know what it is like to be tortured and crucified (though I have been in the hospitals in America which is close).
That's my only point. I've found that Americans are easily divided into those who have been married and have children and those who don't. They both look at life differently.
Apologies for the snark (couldn't resist). This question touches on issues that make me wonder weather I'm super perceptive or merely insane. I offered my take on the underlying issue further down the main thread. As is the case in so many instances, that which is a rational choice for the individual may not be the best for society. Be well, sir.
I have never had children and understand that parenthood has some very special opportunities to learn about love , caring and so so much more. I did spend 20 + years working with children ages 5-8 and spent two years being one of the primary caregivers for a 2 and 4 year old. I also have 2 mini Dachsunds and that relationship over the last 8 years has provided another chance to be a caregiver , small dogs take extra duties ....especially when there are two . I believe that the experience of being a caregiver can be explored outside the nuclear family. There is no experience like birth or being a parent , I can say that even with the level of ignorance in personal experience. The planet is not doing so well with this idea of more people or even the population that currently exists. The environment and natural world are crying for less not more, or a wholly different way of living than we have chosen . Innovation and change are occurring more rapidly than ever before without the necessity of more people. AI has and is likely to provide a level of creativity and innovation beyond what we can imagine. The real attention needs to be developing a culture that has community as a priority, in a way that is beyond the nuclear family....it has to be the whole family ...everyone is a parent and all of us interact and care for children. We face existential crisis that is based on acting as individuals and that includes individual families with individual kids , houses , cars . It is unsustainable and is coming apart at the seams. I am not suggesting a centralized government in control ...no not at all . Perhaps learning to be rational , learning to love . I am not sure we can do it ....it's a different way of thinking and being in the world . It is not Me first, America first , or Humans first ...it is considering all the parts of an interconnected world as vital . Again I am not sure we can do it. We have hard lessons in front of us and it will become more difficult to have those 2.1 children or 3 going forward ....good luck . There will be challenges to have fewer children, but humans need to find a vastly new way of living on this planet ....the status quo is not working out very well.
Lotta "there" there so I'll stick with The Big One: There are many things that could cause the card castle to collapse; one of these is the few young realizing that they can no longer (or are no longer) willing to support the many elderly.
I respect your opinion but I find it troublesome. The natural world is crying for less?! It seems so prideful to me that we thing we can control the natural world. This comment is the most troubling to me in light of what is currently happening in America today:
“The real attention needs to be developing a culture that has community as a priority, in a way that is beyond the nuclear family....it has to be the whole family ...everyone is a parent and all of us interact and care for children. We face existential crisis that is based on acting as individuals and that includes individual families with individual kids , houses , cars.”
While community is wonderful it should not reach into the nuclear family and parent my children. Everyone is not a parent. I am my kid’s parent. I am not my two granddaughter’s parent. My daughter and her husband are their parents and I am here to love, support and cherish.
No I think you have it . The nuclear family is important but it takes community to be a healthy family. We are so polarized , community allows us to find common ground. In America each must have his own car , house and so much . It is just not sustainable. We have been the biggest consumption problem on the planet The natural world is crying for us to consume less to quit polluting the oceans , water , air and atmosphere. The rate of extinction of animals on the planet is undermining critical ecosystems ....not to mention that they are also beautiful sentient beings. We might not have much common ground here and writing on socail media excerbates that . What would be useful would be to shake hands , speak in person and try to find out what we have in common first ....I have expressed only my opinions and that alone does not begin to create effective communication or understanding. Thank you for your comments they make me feel some of how you see it differently it would be wonderful to have a real conversation.
Never in the 100 millennial span of man’s dominance (some would argue that 100 millennia could indeed be 400 millennia) over The Creation has Man ever had it so good - illness, accidents, natural catastrophes, even the weather to a (much) lesser extent are being brought down to the desires of man. Oh, don’t think I’m unaware that’s it’s a terrible world out there but compared to just a few generations ago, or ten fold generations ago, we have SO MUCH to celebrate. And yet, instead of celebration we’re living as if tomorrow is doom, that there’s no reason to continue as an entity. As an evangelical Christian I see this as the time when "fill the earth" should be a joy rather than a curse uttered from too many lips.
Children are typically much more capable than given credit for.
My wife and I are avid hikers. For 25 years we would take a 6 to 10 day extended hike through some portion of the Rockies in late Fall. First time we took our 10 year old daughter we encountered some nasty winter weather and elected to cross the continental divide a day earlier than planned which involved a 15 mile hike and a 2500 foot climb and descent in snow and sleet. We reached our destination rather exhausted only to watch our daughter running through the woods, swinging upside down from a tree limb, and singing. We never again confused complaining with capability.
I have a story that I'll spare all y'all about me, my preteen daughter, and the Bright Angel Trail at the Grand Canyon. Applicable punchline is that I had a hard time getting out of bed the next morning. My daughter was ready to do it again...
1. Your job is to be your child's parent, not their friend.
2. Give your children what they need, not what they want. You may have to think about that before you see that I am being kind, not cruel!
3. Be prepared for tantrums and temporary hatred (see rule#1). Children can blast an emotional flamethrower at you when you don't give in. It hurts, and weak parents fold in the face of it (thus teaching the worst lesson ever: if you complain enough the grown-ups give in). Strong parents are flame-proof.
4. As your children individuate, you get to become more friend, and less parent, but never, ever lose the parental role, which is to provide an anchor for even adult children to rely upon.
5. Your reward is your fine grown-up children appropriately parenting your grandchildren. You have to be prepared to wait, but it's worth it.
Thank you for these stories. As a grandmother twice widowed and mother of four living sons, one son who passed at 33, and a stillborn only daughter, each story resonated in a unique way. Each story awakened hope for humanity in the spirit, love and sanctity born again in each child in each generation.
The couple were unprepared for parenthood when the mother to be was only 26? Her career was in jeopardy? Ugh! After decades of feminist activism, it still her career that takes the hit? Raising children is damned hard and expensive and wonderful and a blessing. And it still mostly takes two to tango. Where was the father in all this? Why wasn’t his career jeopardized in any way?
My kids were born in Seattle in 1976 and '79. I took them hiking often. I taught them self-reliance and the importance of diet and exercise. I worked hard at stopping their whining.
Now they are in their forties and both have had plenty of adventures. Neither is married or has children or a house. Too expensive. My daughter does have a car.
The economy and society in the USA today are very tough for younger generations.
The human race is always only 45 years from extinction.
I'm not sure I give a shit either way anymore.
Thanks (once again) for bold stories in the face of victim-mentality! Raised as the oldest child of young parents (21 and 26) and then being an adoptive mom (at 36 and 40) of two (now) grown children I realized that waiting until the “ideal” time for babies is way over-rated. But being a parent is not!
how awesome! kudos to you all, a “hurrican” of fresh air!
We raised five children who are good citizens who have served their country and community.
They have raised twelve children-all good students, hard workers and good citizens with none of the crazy upside down cultural nonsense we witness everyday.
They will enjoy these stories.
Many thanks.
Late to the party again... for anyone willing to listen: One of my many tiresome tropes is that we are no longer designed to match our environment. Behold the age at which we are fertile. It corresponds far better to our period of ability to survive parenting than does waiting until midlife when we've finally managed to convince ourselves that we're Really Ready. For reasons painful to relate I did not lay the keels of children until 31 and 38. The former kinda late, the latter really late. You are more able than you think.
I applaud Steven Rinella. It's a father's job to teach kids the tough lessons. Men instinctively understand tough love. Mom's, not so much. I love women and
Were you struck by lightening?
Twice.
Being a parent is the toughest thing I've ever done. I was 42 when my daughter was born. When she was 4, I was born again one afternoon when I called on Jesus to be my Savior. Since then, the teaching of Jesus has served as my guide for raising her. I tell her, God is love and if you don't know love you don't know God. I believe our country is in the shape its in because the word of God has disappeared from so many homes. I guess we could call it a falling away.
Seed of Abraham: Jesus didn't get married or have kids.
Yes, you are very correct. Please elaborate more concerning your reply. Tell me where you are going with this. I think we will have a good discussion.
Seed of Abraham: My point is that since Jesus didn't get married or have children He can't know what it is really like. I don't know what it is like to be tortured and crucified (though I have been in the hospitals in America which is close).
That's my only point. I've found that Americans are easily divided into those who have been married and have children and those who don't. They both look at life differently.
You didn't figure out what caused that until 42? (Asking for a friend.)
Cut me some slack. I didn't get married until I was 35. I'm a firm believer in waiting till later in life to pursue marriage and children.
Apologies for the snark (couldn't resist). This question touches on issues that make me wonder weather I'm super perceptive or merely insane. I offered my take on the underlying issue further down the main thread. As is the case in so many instances, that which is a rational choice for the individual may not be the best for society. Be well, sir.
I have never had children and understand that parenthood has some very special opportunities to learn about love , caring and so so much more. I did spend 20 + years working with children ages 5-8 and spent two years being one of the primary caregivers for a 2 and 4 year old. I also have 2 mini Dachsunds and that relationship over the last 8 years has provided another chance to be a caregiver , small dogs take extra duties ....especially when there are two . I believe that the experience of being a caregiver can be explored outside the nuclear family. There is no experience like birth or being a parent , I can say that even with the level of ignorance in personal experience. The planet is not doing so well with this idea of more people or even the population that currently exists. The environment and natural world are crying for less not more, or a wholly different way of living than we have chosen . Innovation and change are occurring more rapidly than ever before without the necessity of more people. AI has and is likely to provide a level of creativity and innovation beyond what we can imagine. The real attention needs to be developing a culture that has community as a priority, in a way that is beyond the nuclear family....it has to be the whole family ...everyone is a parent and all of us interact and care for children. We face existential crisis that is based on acting as individuals and that includes individual families with individual kids , houses , cars . It is unsustainable and is coming apart at the seams. I am not suggesting a centralized government in control ...no not at all . Perhaps learning to be rational , learning to love . I am not sure we can do it ....it's a different way of thinking and being in the world . It is not Me first, America first , or Humans first ...it is considering all the parts of an interconnected world as vital . Again I am not sure we can do it. We have hard lessons in front of us and it will become more difficult to have those 2.1 children or 3 going forward ....good luck . There will be challenges to have fewer children, but humans need to find a vastly new way of living on this planet ....the status quo is not working out very well.
Lotta "there" there so I'll stick with The Big One: There are many things that could cause the card castle to collapse; one of these is the few young realizing that they can no longer (or are no longer) willing to support the many elderly.
I respect your opinion but I find it troublesome. The natural world is crying for less?! It seems so prideful to me that we thing we can control the natural world. This comment is the most troubling to me in light of what is currently happening in America today:
“The real attention needs to be developing a culture that has community as a priority, in a way that is beyond the nuclear family....it has to be the whole family ...everyone is a parent and all of us interact and care for children. We face existential crisis that is based on acting as individuals and that includes individual families with individual kids , houses , cars.”
While community is wonderful it should not reach into the nuclear family and parent my children. Everyone is not a parent. I am my kid’s parent. I am not my two granddaughter’s parent. My daughter and her husband are their parents and I am here to love, support and cherish.
Perhaps I misunderstood your comment.
No I think you have it . The nuclear family is important but it takes community to be a healthy family. We are so polarized , community allows us to find common ground. In America each must have his own car , house and so much . It is just not sustainable. We have been the biggest consumption problem on the planet The natural world is crying for us to consume less to quit polluting the oceans , water , air and atmosphere. The rate of extinction of animals on the planet is undermining critical ecosystems ....not to mention that they are also beautiful sentient beings. We might not have much common ground here and writing on socail media excerbates that . What would be useful would be to shake hands , speak in person and try to find out what we have in common first ....I have expressed only my opinions and that alone does not begin to create effective communication or understanding. Thank you for your comments they make me feel some of how you see it differently it would be wonderful to have a real conversation.
What a cruel joke is man.
Never in the 100 millennial span of man’s dominance (some would argue that 100 millennia could indeed be 400 millennia) over The Creation has Man ever had it so good - illness, accidents, natural catastrophes, even the weather to a (much) lesser extent are being brought down to the desires of man. Oh, don’t think I’m unaware that’s it’s a terrible world out there but compared to just a few generations ago, or ten fold generations ago, we have SO MUCH to celebrate. And yet, instead of celebration we’re living as if tomorrow is doom, that there’s no reason to continue as an entity. As an evangelical Christian I see this as the time when "fill the earth" should be a joy rather than a curse uttered from too many lips.
For a Father's story about parenting go to http://howtostopbeatingyourwife.com/
Children are typically much more capable than given credit for.
My wife and I are avid hikers. For 25 years we would take a 6 to 10 day extended hike through some portion of the Rockies in late Fall. First time we took our 10 year old daughter we encountered some nasty winter weather and elected to cross the continental divide a day earlier than planned which involved a 15 mile hike and a 2500 foot climb and descent in snow and sleet. We reached our destination rather exhausted only to watch our daughter running through the woods, swinging upside down from a tree limb, and singing. We never again confused complaining with capability.
I have a story that I'll spare all y'all about me, my preteen daughter, and the Bright Angel Trail at the Grand Canyon. Applicable punchline is that I had a hard time getting out of bed the next morning. My daughter was ready to do it again...
Love this!!!
My wife had two rules
Raise your child so that others will love them because a parent’s love is automatic
And, raise them to be employable, marriageable, and the person God wants them to be which is not necessarily who you want them to be.
So true
Some rules for parents:
1. Your job is to be your child's parent, not their friend.
2. Give your children what they need, not what they want. You may have to think about that before you see that I am being kind, not cruel!
3. Be prepared for tantrums and temporary hatred (see rule#1). Children can blast an emotional flamethrower at you when you don't give in. It hurts, and weak parents fold in the face of it (thus teaching the worst lesson ever: if you complain enough the grown-ups give in). Strong parents are flame-proof.
4. As your children individuate, you get to become more friend, and less parent, but never, ever lose the parental role, which is to provide an anchor for even adult children to rely upon.
5. Your reward is your fine grown-up children appropriately parenting your grandchildren. You have to be prepared to wait, but it's worth it.
Christopher Moss: 1-4 rules are very good. #5 is not a rule, it's a wish.
Such a brilliant post!
I love each of these stories - thank you!
Thank you for these stories. As a grandmother twice widowed and mother of four living sons, one son who passed at 33, and a stillborn only daughter, each story resonated in a unique way. Each story awakened hope for humanity in the spirit, love and sanctity born again in each child in each generation.