"We don't know for certain" is both irrefutable and pointless. It's an eternally moving target because the people who raise this argument will always say that no matter how much we know or how much we've studied something, it isn't enough. It's never really about risk, however, because most people are perfectly happy to forego regular exercise, eat too much refined sugar, drink alcohol, drive over the speed limit, etc.
By all means, we should keep studying the safety of cultivated meat, but it's significant that nobody with actual knowledge of biology has even come up with a reasonable hypothesis for how it MIGHT be harmful. By the time this stuff hits your bloodstream, it's molecularly indistinguishable from real meat.
Florida's ban is stupid. I predict that it will not age well, and its promoters will have to back into rationalizations when they're finally shown to have been idiots.
When I was taking Chemistry, nearly 50 years ago, we were learned at one point about esters and their role in making flavors and scents. Our teacher told us that if you saw a bottle of "natural" orange extract and another bottle of "artificial" orange extract, that those adjectives were LEGAL terms, referring to the process whence they came, NOT their chemical composition. So, we learned, some "artificial" extracts were chemically different than the natural ("real") thing, BUT some were 100% identical. Literally indistinguishable. But if in a lab you were able to replicate the precise molecule for natural whatever flavor, you still had to call it "artificial". And that's kind of weird, I think.
From my understanding of the promise of lab grown meat the intent is to create the exact same thing in an industrial application as nature creates in a cow. And if they can do that, I personally would have zero problem "putting it in" my children and grandchildren (as that legislator put it). The only thing I want the FDA to do (and I do still hold out hope that the FDA would be a better arbiter of this than the Florida Legislature) is to determine if it is, in fact the same thing. Of course, this will be easier to see when they are able to come up with actual T-bone steaks instead of ground beef.
I do acknowledge that Covid taught us that the scientists and politicians are not always to be trusted. At the same time, I think we need to be educated about science to guide us in our decision making. As my example with esters was intended to point out, sometimes we worry about things that literally pose no threat. I haven't had any lab-grown meat yet, but I'd be perfectly willing to eat some today.
One last thing: I do not believe that eating meat is in any way immoral, nor do I care about meat's ostensible threat to the climate. Still, if a hundred years hence, we can get our meat without having to house thousands of animals in industrial farms, I think that would be a good thing. But I also would hope that this would never stop us from having a culture which respects the rights of Americans to hunt for their meat in the wild.
“ ‘Until we have long-term studies that tell me what lab-grown immortalized cells do to your body, I challenge you to put it in your child,’ said Florida State Representative Danny Alvarez, a co-sponsor of the bill banning cultivated meat.”
Funny. That was the thought-process that guided my decisions about mRNA vaccine technology.
consumers should be the ones to ultimately decide whether or not they want to eat cultivated meat.This sentence pretty much sums it up.
The Republicans should realize they're not much different the next time they complain about the democratic government telling people what to do, like maybe wear masks during a pandemic but banning something even before it's a thing is okay, such hypocrites.
Let the market decide. I doubt anyone will adopt a diet consisting of only lab-cultivated meat but some people might like to try it. If you're not one of those, don't buy or eat it, but don't dictate to everyone else. With nothing showing it's harmful, it shouldn't be banned.
That fraken meat needs to go through real FDA trials before it gets to the public. Long term trials with 10's of thousands of people that are monitored.
Time and time again we've been fed food that turns out to be not so great for you (trans fats)
One politician opposed to lab grown meat said: ”we are still discovering things” and as far as cultivated meat goes, “there is no need to rush this to market.”
I know a few cows about to get a piston to the head and their throats slashed who would disagree.
The word salad surrounding these politics, arguments, and positions is just amazing! I see this a bit differently. I have questions... The 84% lean ground cow beef in my fridge today is $8.49/pound (USD). What does/will the lab-grown stuff cost? How long will it keep in the fridge? How can I tell when it's gone bad? Can I serve it with confidence at our family picnic? SHould I serve it to my boss and his wife? How will our bodies feel after we've left the table? Will my kids grow an extra eye, toe, or limb in a few months or years? How now, brown cow? Does your meat loaf?
Very similar to the idea of manufacturing a vaccine from spike protein. The effects of COVID vaccines have yet to be fully understood, but from John Campbell's research in the UK and the legions of converts to his daily chats on YouTube, there is much our gov'ts have not told us. And the same will be the effects from this fake product. We are already coping with questionable animal husbandry and feed protocols, now we're going to grow chicken breast in a laboratory? I'm not buying it.
I want the right to choose to purchase this product, or not. The market will decide the viability of lab grown meat.
If we have to ban things, banning the non-existent ones is the way to go.
"We don't know for certain" is both irrefutable and pointless. It's an eternally moving target because the people who raise this argument will always say that no matter how much we know or how much we've studied something, it isn't enough. It's never really about risk, however, because most people are perfectly happy to forego regular exercise, eat too much refined sugar, drink alcohol, drive over the speed limit, etc.
By all means, we should keep studying the safety of cultivated meat, but it's significant that nobody with actual knowledge of biology has even come up with a reasonable hypothesis for how it MIGHT be harmful. By the time this stuff hits your bloodstream, it's molecularly indistinguishable from real meat.
Florida's ban is stupid. I predict that it will not age well, and its promoters will have to back into rationalizations when they're finally shown to have been idiots.
When I was taking Chemistry, nearly 50 years ago, we were learned at one point about esters and their role in making flavors and scents. Our teacher told us that if you saw a bottle of "natural" orange extract and another bottle of "artificial" orange extract, that those adjectives were LEGAL terms, referring to the process whence they came, NOT their chemical composition. So, we learned, some "artificial" extracts were chemically different than the natural ("real") thing, BUT some were 100% identical. Literally indistinguishable. But if in a lab you were able to replicate the precise molecule for natural whatever flavor, you still had to call it "artificial". And that's kind of weird, I think.
From my understanding of the promise of lab grown meat the intent is to create the exact same thing in an industrial application as nature creates in a cow. And if they can do that, I personally would have zero problem "putting it in" my children and grandchildren (as that legislator put it). The only thing I want the FDA to do (and I do still hold out hope that the FDA would be a better arbiter of this than the Florida Legislature) is to determine if it is, in fact the same thing. Of course, this will be easier to see when they are able to come up with actual T-bone steaks instead of ground beef.
I do acknowledge that Covid taught us that the scientists and politicians are not always to be trusted. At the same time, I think we need to be educated about science to guide us in our decision making. As my example with esters was intended to point out, sometimes we worry about things that literally pose no threat. I haven't had any lab-grown meat yet, but I'd be perfectly willing to eat some today.
One last thing: I do not believe that eating meat is in any way immoral, nor do I care about meat's ostensible threat to the climate. Still, if a hundred years hence, we can get our meat without having to house thousands of animals in industrial farms, I think that would be a good thing. But I also would hope that this would never stop us from having a culture which respects the rights of Americans to hunt for their meat in the wild.
You should consider visiting a factory farm before deciding on the morality of eating meat.
“ ‘Until we have long-term studies that tell me what lab-grown immortalized cells do to your body, I challenge you to put it in your child,’ said Florida State Representative Danny Alvarez, a co-sponsor of the bill banning cultivated meat.”
Funny. That was the thought-process that guided my decisions about mRNA vaccine technology.
consumers should be the ones to ultimately decide whether or not they want to eat cultivated meat.This sentence pretty much sums it up.
The Republicans should realize they're not much different the next time they complain about the democratic government telling people what to do, like maybe wear masks during a pandemic but banning something even before it's a thing is okay, such hypocrites.
Let the market decide. I doubt anyone will adopt a diet consisting of only lab-cultivated meat but some people might like to try it. If you're not one of those, don't buy or eat it, but don't dictate to everyone else. With nothing showing it's harmful, it shouldn't be banned.
That fraken meat needs to go through real FDA trials before it gets to the public. Long term trials with 10's of thousands of people that are monitored.
Time and time again we've been fed food that turns out to be not so great for you (trans fats)
Italy did it, so should USA and Canada too
One politician opposed to lab grown meat said: ”we are still discovering things” and as far as cultivated meat goes, “there is no need to rush this to market.”
I know a few cows about to get a piston to the head and their throats slashed who would disagree.
The word salad surrounding these politics, arguments, and positions is just amazing! I see this a bit differently. I have questions... The 84% lean ground cow beef in my fridge today is $8.49/pound (USD). What does/will the lab-grown stuff cost? How long will it keep in the fridge? How can I tell when it's gone bad? Can I serve it with confidence at our family picnic? SHould I serve it to my boss and his wife? How will our bodies feel after we've left the table? Will my kids grow an extra eye, toe, or limb in a few months or years? How now, brown cow? Does your meat loaf?
Omg, who would trust the FDA!
Off-topic, but River Page is one cool name.
Very similar to the idea of manufacturing a vaccine from spike protein. The effects of COVID vaccines have yet to be fully understood, but from John Campbell's research in the UK and the legions of converts to his daily chats on YouTube, there is much our gov'ts have not told us. And the same will be the effects from this fake product. We are already coping with questionable animal husbandry and feed protocols, now we're going to grow chicken breast in a laboratory? I'm not buying it.
Is it true that many anti-GMO people are pro-Lab Meat? That's pretty hard to swallow.
You didn't!
Well-played